Yard To Table

From Backyard Gardeners to Growing Guides: Paula & Orna of Wild About Veggies

• Trevor Crafts and Ellen Scherer Crafts • Season 2 • Episode 8

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In this episode, Ellen and Trevor chat with Paula Koffsky and Orna Stern, founders of Wild About Veggies and certified Connecticut Master Gardeners. They share how their love of growing (and cooking!) sparked a mission to help others cultivate thriving organic gardens. From tomatoes and trap crops to beginner tips and watering wisdom, this episode is packed with practical advice and backyard inspiration.

Follow Wild About Veggies on Instagram here  and visit their website!

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Trevor:

Oh. Well, hello Ellen.

Ellen :

Well, hello Trevor,

Trevor:

back at the table, as always for another episode of yard to table. That's right, and today it is. It's good. We're inside, and we don't do this podcast outside, because, if we were outside, it's a lot of reasons, there would be something real risk of electrocution. I mean, in a serious way, there would we might we might fry.

Ellen :

Yeah, it's pouring a little rainy. I'm hoping that we don't have an early summer like we had the first summer we moved to Connecticut and early summer. Do you remember what the first early summer was like here in Connecticut? What's an early summer like? Early early part of summer? Early summer.

Trevor:

Oh, you hope we don't have a similar kind of summer in the early period of time as we are having a chart? I mean, I could, apparently, I do need a chart. Apparently, need a lot of charts,

Ellen :

hoping that we don't have a early weather summer like we have. Yes,

Trevor:

thank you. I decided what the other side was, okay, yeah, sure. You don't want it to rain as much as the same time that it rained last, yes, when

Ellen :

we first got here. Succinctly, that's it, that stuff. It was like a month.

Trevor:

It was essentially a Noah's Ark situation.

Ellen :

And I thought we have moved from California, that was big, to whales, or Seattle, which we had talked about Seattle, and I didn't want to move to see talks about whales too.

Trevor:

But yeah, it was very wet. And while that's good in certain circumstances, because less watering, and we know things are getting sort of naturally hydrated, I think it's it. We're pushing it. It's getting pretty close to very too wet,

Ellen :

just for my mood. I need some sun. That's all I'm saying. That's all I'm saying.

Trevor:

Today was a today's a rough one,

Ellen :

yeah, but I'm excited, because things are growing. They're growing well, we have a different plan. We've talked about that for the garden this year because of the quite ambitious renovation we've taken on our Yeah, almost 100 year old.

Trevor:

We're getting closer, though. We really are.

Ellen :

We are rounding the corner. I can stand in the spaces and feel their their process.

Trevor:

Yes, wood is in the kiln. Yes, we talked about that a while back that the wood was going to go in, but now it is

Ellen :

and we found more places to use the wood from our yard, actually in,

Trevor:

lovely beach that we're putting in as as counter tops. We Charter Oak or Charter Oak that we're putting in for kitchen tables. This is it's going to be

Ellen :

great. I am sad that we had to scale back on our veggies this summer a little bit. But we really, literally don't have any place to process them, restore them, or all that other good service. Still learning lots of veggies don't do not despair. Just pulled some delicious radishes out,

Trevor:

and we're still getting asparagus. It's not done yet. Yes, you're still kicking around nice and lovely lettuce is a go, go. Yes, the lettuces are epic right now, which is good. But you know,

Ellen :

we are constantly learning in this process of growing our garden, and this year and every year, gardens are different. And this year we're going to have a more flower friendly space on one side, so I'll have lots of bouquets keep me happy while my home is in chaos.

Trevor:

Very important for all of us. Very important, by the way,

Ellen :

today and today, we have two amazing guests that are going to talk about gardens and garden planning and their inspirations around gardens. And I'm very excited.

Trevor:

This is a very auspicious episode, because this is our first double guest episode. Very exciting.

Ellen :

It is exciting. We're pushing all the levels of technology on our podcast. Well, shall, shall I introduce

Trevor:

I would love for you to bring our guest ever forward,

Ellen :

live on the line, okay, well,

Trevor:

but not just here in front of us here in France. It sounds good. Sounded great.

Ellen :

Our guests today have a combined mission to help people grow their own healthy, organic herbs and vegetables, which we love, and believe that we all have the ability to grow a garden with the right tools and guidance. That is so true. And they are examples of this themselves. They started growing in their backyards and became inspired to become kinetic, master gardeners. I'm still thinking, if I want to do this, by the way, that's a whole conversation. And from there, there, they started a business to help others feel the growing joy. Do you like that? It's wild about veggies, and so we would love to welcome to the table paulakowski And Orna stern from wild about veggies. Welcome.

Paula:

Hi. Thank you. Thank you for having us.

Ellen :

Well, we are so excited to have you. We I feel there's so much every day that we learn with our gardens. But first, let's we always like to talk about how we're all connected. So Paula, we met,

Trevor:

wait a minute, wait a minute. Let's take a guess. Where did we meet? We met in a yard.

Paula:

Imagine that

Trevor:

which is, which is essentially where we meet all of our good friends, is in a yard.

Ellen :

It's so true. And you we met in the yard here at Stone Brook and at the at the dinner that we threw with Liz and Moni in our christened our new patio. It was your birthday dinner. It was, well, dinner adjacent birthday dinner. But

Paula:

it was a beautiful beautiful event. I remember it very well. I was so happy to be here. It was so beautiful. Your Yard was singing with flourishes, and it

Trevor:

was great. It was nice little October. So we were right, sort of on the tail end of things, but there was still plenty of stuff that was kicking around, which was nice. Yeah,

Ellen :

we did that in conjunction with the Westport Farmers Market, which was amazing. And the The whelk, the chef from The whelk was here. Was just a beautiful night. Got a little chilly, but it was just like a perfect herb blankets got a little chilly early fall night. Trevor, you know what an early fall evening is.

Trevor:

So Paula, it was great that you got a chance to come to that party, because we got a chance to meet you. And Liz has often extolled on all of the amazing things in your yard.

Ellen :

Well, I specifically remember that night Liz saying to me, Ellen, you need to talk to Paula. She makes the best tomatoes, throws the best tomatoes. That's true.

Trevor:

And essentially, when Liz says anything, you just have to do it and listen. Yes, she's Liz. Liz knows. She knows, but it was great because we also then saw you and Orna at Lechat.

Paula:

It was so nice of you to come to our little talk. Was great to see you there. But I wanted to just say that the dinner was had an a lasting effect on me, because I was introduced to the coconut

Ellen :

ah, and Paula brought us a little present today. Tell us about this.

Paula:

Well, your dinner was so lovely. It was, as you mentioned, seasonal vegetables and some from our own the menu from your own garden as well. And we were served this delicious, creamy, beautiful, golden colored soup. And I was blown away. The menu said it was cogent nut squash soup. I said, What is a coconut? This is so delicious I have to know. So the chef came out, and he explained that this was a hybrid squash between made between a butternut and a kombucha squash. I was determined to grow the squash and have it for myself, so I brought you the last of the harvest of my cogenerative squash,

Trevor:

and it's absolutely gorgeous. It's got that sort of Cinderella pumpkin, sort of dusky, beautiful quality

Ellen :

about gardening is you have this beautiful vegetable that you grew, and it's the early, early summer Trevor and your and if you store it properly, it is still viable. It is something you can eat, and it's delicious and nutritious and healthy, and it came from your garden. I love that means so much. Sharing and making food is our number one connection. So thank you. We love that so much.

Paula:

My pleasure, and I was so happy to see it in my cupboard. And I thought, Wow, I'm bringing this to Trevor and Alan because it's here because of them.

Trevor:

And it's fun that you know that both do so much for yourselves, for your clients. You know so much that even all of our knowledge, there's still something like, I don't know what that is. I'm gonna go figure it out and find the seeds and get it and plant it and see if it grows. That's the fun part about all this, is we get to learn and explore so much all the time,

Paula:

and there's always something new to learn every season. And that's one of the reasons why I love gardening so much. Yeah, never stop learning.

Ellen :

Never stop learning. Well. And then, of course, we got to meet Orna through you, Paula and so Orna tell us what got you growing

Orna:

so. I grew up in Israel, and their fresh vegetables and fruits are common like you go to the market and it's everywhere. I mean, the food tastes much better. I have to admit it, when come here. I remember my father when he first came to visit after I got married. My husband is American. He said, There's no taste to these fruits. These strawberries are bland. So I went to the farm farm, and I picked up some strawberries, and he said, Well, okay, that's better. And it took me a few years, and my kids were older, and I'd started with a small garden, then I added some herb garden, and I added another garden. And of course, after I met Paul, I mean, I met Paul, I like, Okay, I need more, but it will take time. And so that's really and I love cooking. It's one of my passions. And of course, there is nothing like cooking fresh with fresh herbs. Yeah, and and then you cook by the season, because every season there is a different vegetable that comes up. So, you know, you're not going to cook tomatoes right the beginning of the season, because they're not fresh. You're going to wait till like mid summer, and other examples like that.

Ellen :

It's so true. And I think the whole idea of how your garden expands, particularly when you start talking about gardening with your friends, and you're sharing things, because we've have, we have lots of conversations about expanding our beds in the footprint of our garden. So I understand that and how gardening friends can be a good and bad influence on you in those in those things. But Paul, how did you start growing

Paula:

when our youngest left for college. My husband not good at sitting. He actually, I understand that his kindergarten teacher said he needs, needs improvement in resting. Keep reminding him that that's still the case. I love it. He went out to the backyard and started to build a garden. And

Trevor:

I was prompted, unprompted him to do this. Or was this just

Paula:

not in the least. Oh my gosh, I was, I was like, the opposite of the little red hen. I was like, who's gonna, who's gonna, who do you think's gonna do that? Who's gonna take care of the garden? You know, gardens are a lot of work. I understand. I've heard if they're a lot of work. I don't know anything about gardening, and neither do you all. I know is, he was walking around with a tool belt for three summers. He kept going back to Home Depot to get more wood. I got to get more wood. I'm getting more wood. We ended up with a 30 by 30 foot enclosure. He built the beds the whole time. I'm telling him, I don't know anything about gardening. You don't have time. I don't have time. Here we are 10 years later, and it's a business. Orna and I are very busy. We have no time.

Trevor:

See, this is the thing. This is, see, this is very similar conversation that I'm having about chickens with with Ellen, is we should get chickens. We should get chickens. And she's saying the same thing, who's going to take care of these chickens? How's it going to work? Well, honey, apparently, in 10 years, we'll have a huge chicken business, that's right, if we follow the same pattern.

Ellen :

So anyway, okay, so we're gonna keep going. So you both. Was there any So you started growing different sort of different impetuses for each of you, right? Intentional and non intentional. I love that. So was there a first thing that you decided to grow for each of you. Was it herbs for you, Orna, or

Orna:

I can't remember? And so many years ago, I think it was both. It was, was vegetables and herbs. And I mean, as Paula said before, it was every year I tried something new and I learned more. Because will you learn by doing? Even now, after we took the Connecticut Master Gardener, which will get into it in a second. We still learn from and from what happens like, you know, suddenly, oh, something happened. What? Why is it not growing? No, of course. And you know, we put this like, for example, I just was studying about fennel, so you can put fennel next to tomatoes, because it started growth like, Oh, interesting. But apprenal, it's different. It can grow in the herb department. So

Ellen :

this is the stuff you

Trevor:

know you're saying. And let me ask a different question, because this is adjacent to your because it's Ellen adjacent, anything Ellen adjacent is always better than my stuff. But is there some vegetable that you grew that then sort of was a spark where you said, Ah, this is amazing. Now, this is the thing I got it. I understand why this. Everybody likes to do

Paula:

this all the time. What happens all the time? Yes,

Ellen :

I get that go ahead.

Paula:

It's all so exciting. The first vegetable that that I that my husband and I grew was a garlic, because he had a friend who had a garlic farm and gave him 40 cloves of garlic. Awesome. It was a great way to start because it's foolproof. You don't have to do anything. You just put it in and then set it and forget it, kind of thing. And I was like, wow, that was easy. This is amazing. Like, I put one clove in and you get an a head of garlic. Like, what a great deal. Yeah. Like, where else can you do

Trevor:

garden? Sadly, I think it's just that there's not a lot of others, like flowers. That's true. Sunflowers,

Ellen :

that's good point, no, and I don't think there's any more satisfying than pulling garlic out like that is, I know every year when we do it, I'm like, oh, that's just feels so good. It's so satisfying, and it's so and it feels, it feels amazing. It

Paula:

does. And there's so many parts to it. Yeah, they're the scapes. And then you watch the leaves turn, turn brown, and then they, like three quarters of the way up, they're they're yellow. Then you know, to pull the garlic, and you can dry, then you dry the garlic. And there's just so many steps to it that you get into it. You do naturally. It's it draws you in, and

Ellen :

it's a rhythm of the season. We talk a lot about this on this podcast, about how. Seasonal. Our lives have become again. We were East Coasters before we lived in California for a time. Now we're back, but I look forward to that. It's like it's time to cut the scapes, and it's going to be time to pull the garlic, it's time to dry the garlic, it's time to store the garlic. And I think that is your and the months go on and you feel like you that is your, your seasonality that you're really getting into.

Paula:

And there's always something to look forward look forward to. Yes, yes, I'm

Ellen :

currently looking forward to scape pesto. Yes, that's my Yeah. So Orna, you mentioned it, certified master gardeners. You guys have both completed that training. You You did it together. Was this someone's, someone's idea? Though? Were you like, I'm going to do this, because it is, if people don't know, it is a intense educational outreach initiative, and it gives the folks that go through it a lot of horticultural knowledge. And there's a huge, there's a huge community engagement piece as well, right? That all comes in. So tell, tell us a little bit about how that all began and why you wanted to accomplish that. In addition to everything else, the first,

Paula:

the first time I heard about the program was actually my cousin's wife out in California had done it, and I they were telling me about it, and I thought, Wow, that's so cool. And she was doing volunteer work, and meanwhile, she she had a full time job. She's a nurse, and I thought, That sounds really cool. I'm gonna look into it. I told Orna about it, and she said, we're gonna do it and we're gonna do it together. I love it. So we did. We signed up together, and it was great to have that partnership going through it together. Was actually before COVID started. We joined, and then it was COVID that that spring of 2020, so we ended up going part remote, which was a little bit of a disappointment. However, we were able to start the program in person, which I think made a really, really,

Trevor:

how long, how long is the total to get it finished?

Ellen :

And what are the elements

Orna:

a year?

Paula:

Okay, yeah, you absolutely apply. And not

Orna:

only in January, indoor and it's like they study till almost now till June, and then in June, June till September, you have to do like volunteer work. Also, there is two parts. Part of it is like working in the fields in different places like Sherwood Island or Wakeman farm, Lechat farm that's around here, Westport, Western in Stamford, there are the places you walk about at Arboretum, that's where we studied. And then also you do what they call plant clinic. So if anybody has a problem about their plants, they send the question to a plant clinic. So they always master gardeners and interns, so that's part of the learning. And it's not only about vegetables, it's also about trees, shrubs, anything to do with the garden, and then they get a certificate. So when we graduated, I looked at Paula, and I said, Paula, we should do something about it, because it's nice for ourselves, but let's spread the word. And then it took a year, and then we ran with it.

Ellen :

So as you're kind of talking through the program, there's courses that you need to take, and they're about plant health and growing and science is that tell us a little bit about that part.

Paula:

The topics are fascinating, and they're things that I never thought that I would study botany, for instance, and they're each like a mini course. And you have to do studying at home as well as at Bartlett, which is where we took the course, you have to go home and do a lot of studying. And there are exams throughout the course, botany, turf water, so you learn about watersheds and how important it is for our water to be clean, because we're What's your watershed. And throughout the country, everybody is taking water from their own watershed. Of course, in Weston, it's so important that we have clean water, because we're on wells, right, which

Ellen :

is why we always tell people, when you're thinking about using pesticides on your lawn, do you want to drink it? Do you want to drink it? Do you want your children to drink it? Because we're all going to drink it if

Paula:

you drink it, and your animals are going to walk in it and bring it in in the house, that's right, and you're barefoot. And so entomology, which I never thought I would even want to think about inside of it all, it's amazing what you can build a resistance to or a tolerance for. These are fascinating. They really were fascinating topics and what the program is about the ecosystem at large, learning about our ecosystem and how everything is connected, and then giving back to the community. As Orna said, there's a lot of community service involved. We have to complete about 30 hours, including plant clinic as well as in the field. So we learned we both chose farms to work because we're both so fascinated and love vegetables. That's how we really kind of honed our farming skills, or our gardening skills, in addition to our own yards, we learned so much from working with farmers, and that's the kind of thing that I love about gardening, is that you learn so much from being and talking to other gardeners. It's as much as learning on your own is just being an. Alongside and being in the garden with other gardeners and seeing what they do and what they're observing and their techniques. It was a great program.

Ellen :

I love that we talk a lot on the podcast about sharing knowledge, and how this community of people who grow is so generous with time and knowledge when you're starting out in things. And I think that's such a great Hallmark. I think of people who grow there's just this desire to share knowledge and to to support each other in the growing experience in different ways, which I think is so fun.

Trevor:

Were there any points in time in the program where you thought, oh, man, this is hard, like, I don't know, I don't know about this one. This is some tough business. Or was it just one inspiration, micro inspiration, after the next, after the next, after the next.

Orna:

I mean, for me, it was fascinating. Maybe I love learning, and everything was very new. I never thought I will touch bugs. I'm still, like, a little bit weary, but what can I do? It's part of the course. But all the idea

Trevor:

how much spider touching was there never, no,

Orna:

sir, yeah. I remember my daughter is spider phobia.

Ellen :

Yeah, I'm getting better, though I'm getting much better because my hands are in the garden all the time. I remember Christina cother, who, you know she, I think she went through the same class. Yes, Master Gardener with you. State of Nomadica. She, she has this line that says, you know you're not a true gardener until you're squishing bugs with your fingers, right?

Orna:

Doing that now. So yesterday, we were planting a garden for a new client, and I squished the worm came and we realized, Oh, that's a jumping wall. Yeah. Actually squished it. And I was like, what is it on? Are you doing it? I said, yeah,

Trevor:

thank you gotta do it. You gotta get it done.

Ellen :

You gotta do it. I love, I love

Paula:

hunting for for bugs is part of being a gardener. So, yeah, we all know that. And it comes with the territory,

Trevor:

right? We have a curly willow over on the side, little ornamental. And earlier this season, I saw it just was full of holes just, I'm like, There's something on this. And I looked and I looked and I looked and I looked and I looked and I looked, and I was not leaving that spot until I found here, whatever it was, and these little gray caterpillars. And I'm like, Oh, you're coming with me. And that was, that was it for him. And then his friends and his friends, friends. So there was a lot on there. There was a lot, but, yeah, you got to get in there. You got to get your hands dirty.

Ellen :

Yeah, they actually know whether they're good or bad. So that's, that's the other part, right?

Trevor:

So I don't like, are the cucumber beetles, because they stink, yeah, and they're orange when you squish them, huh? And they make your fingers all stained. Looks like you were eating Cheetos, but not in a good way. Lick your fingers

Paula:

well. Another way to get rid of those cucumber beetles is to flick them into a jar of soapy water. Yes, sure you know about that, yes, yes. But maybe you prefer to swish them,

Trevor:

not really a preference.

Orna:

Or another way is you can plant dill, and dill repels their cucumber beetle

Trevor:

companion plants, yeah, exactly

Orna:

plants that help out the plants like for example, that's why we plant basil or marigold around tomatoes, many herbs and Marigold, they really help you with a lotof the deterrent aphids. In other pests.

Ellen :

So we wanted to talk about companion planting today, because that is a big thing. It's big for ensuring that vegetables grow properly. Like you mentioned, some things like each other, some things don't, and also good for pest control, so makes it easier, yeah. And it's also beautiful, by the way. So when you're doing a home garden and you're seeing things that are mixed together, it just is so much more interesting.

Trevor:

Borage isn't ugly, no, it's borage. Look it up as it is lovely and purple, though.

Ellen :

So talk to us about what you guys look to do in your gardens, for your for yourselves and for your clients when you're

Orna:

So I mentioned few vegetables that we all like to grow. Like, for example, tomato around tomato, what you can plant basil, which is improved not only the flavor, it deters pests. Marigolds, repuls the nematode and aphids. Chives, onion chives, also it deter aphids, and also the red spider mite. Now, carrots and lettuce, you can grow underneath the tomato plant because it gives shades to it. Of course you can do potato next tomatoes. So this is something you will learn you can or you cannot. You cannot, no potatoes near. Why is there? Also not because it inhibits the growth. And also no corn, because corn attracts the hornworm, which is this fat. Oh, yes, we made a horn Oh, we've been ruined every tomato. Yes,

Ellen :

we, I think there was a

Trevor:

we get them in our in our way to search,

Paula:

oh, in the fennel. Really, really made a hornworm.

Ellen :

No, I think, no, you get catapillar

Paula:

Tomato Hornworm is huge huge, bigger than one

Ellen :

that somebody lays eggs on, and then it becomes Yes, yes, yes. We've had one every year. Oh,

Paula:

yeah. So gross. It's the wasp.

Ellen :

The Wasp eggs, and they parasitize,

Paula:

like if you see the white cocoons on top, you're supposed to leave it like, it's disgusting.

Trevor:

It's less work for you. It's gonna get taken care of eventually.

Ellen :

I do not like that part, so it's interesting with the tomatoes and the potatoes, is it that they both don't grow, or does one take over for the other?

Paula:

I think it's because they're from the same family, and they rob each other of the same nutrients. Makes sense, like peppers and tomatoes would want the same nutrients, so you might not want to put them together.

Trevor:

It seems funny that tomatoes and potatoes come from the same family, which I find fascinating.

Ellen :

Is it the nightshade family? Yes, yes. So

Trevor:

cool. But not zucchini eggplant, zucchini are not part of no

Paula:

that's orbit. But

Orna:

there is another thing that we like to grow, cucumber, and also cucumbers you don't want to put next to potatoes for the same reason.

Trevor:

So basically, potatoes are just on their own. You just got to push them into the corner. They don't like anybody. Nobody likes them, which is both sad, but they're also delicious.

Paula:

So it's great about potatoes is they help the soil. Yes, they, because they, they aerate the soil.

Ellen :

So it's a good time to plant potatoes, is it? Now? Is in June.

Paula:

I think you can still plant potatoes, but you could have planted them four weeks ago as well. Okay, but do you have potatoes?

Ellen :

I had some potatoes that, yeah, I was gonna plant. So I go for it. Yeah, I'm sure I haven't planted them yet, so I might do it.

Orna:

Experiment potatoes and garlic. Who knows? Who knows?

Ellen :

Well, that's interesting. What about cucumbers and nasturtium?

Orna:

That's another one. So cucumber, dill, nasturtium, which traps aphids, crops, and again, you can do under cucumbers, lettuce and beans. And beans also are good for anything, because they fix the nitrogens in the soil, which will help the cucumber. And then the next ones are peppers and eggplant, which, yes, everybody loves together. Yeah, yes. So peppers again, Basil helps them, onions, carrots, and here we have margarine, oregano, which are great herbs, and they attract the beneficial insects, so they're all good to plant around the peppers. Now for eggplant, we go back. It's the same family as the tomatoes. So we do the marigold, the basil, and you can put thyme next eggplant, which repels the garden most it's you. What you see is like the herbs mostly helps with the vegetables.

Ellen :

If you're thinking about this just as a really easy theory, like, if it tastes good together, it's good to plant together, yeah? 100% right? Yeah. I'm gonna make a sauce, I'm gonna do some basil, I'm gonna do some tomato. They go good together. Someone grown together. That kind of makes sense, right? Onions, they've done other good stuff. I like that.

Paula:

And it's also seasonally too. They go together like lettuce, right? Carrots, radishes, peppers, beans.

Trevor:

Pay attention to the season, because whatever is growing at the time is probably going to work well together, including a potato that is mean to everyone. Rough business for the for the companion planning too. It's essentially anything that makes less work for us humans. I think is a good thing, because whether you are helping people, or whether you're doing it yourself, any less pesky bugs that are on your stuff to drive you insane will help you to feel better about everything in your entire life.

Ellen :

So they're gonna come and find it, by the way. Yeah,

Paula:

you're gonna get some. Well, that's why you should try planting trap crops? Yes, you haven't done that. Now,

Ellen :

we were just visiting your garden recently, Paula, and you had some trap crops up and growing. So tell us a little bit about what that is.

Paula:

Well, what you said is anything that can make your life a little bit easier. If you plant a vegetable that you don't necessarily need to harvest it, you are planting it as a trap crop to lure away a pest. For instance, the Hubbard squash is a lure for the squash bug and squash vine borer. Oh they are so bad, so bad.

Ellen :

They came for us last year with a vengeance. Did you plant Hubbard squash? We did not. I mean it. Yes, we will now. We will now.

Paula:

So a couple of, a couple of key things to do about this next spring is you're going to plant the Hubbard squash before so it's more mature than the zucchini or the patty pan squash, or whatever squash you really are trying to grow so that that'll lure it away. Gotcha. Also this year I'm getting really mean, there's no more fooling around. Okay, now I'm putting mesh over my squash, and you're showing us bikini, and I'm probably gonna hand pollinate because I don't want to scoop out any more squash vine borers.

Trevor:

Yeah, yeah, that was Trevor's job. Last year, was my job, and I was lucky enough that the we did injections of BT, into the which is all organic, which is why we tried it. But we were really at a point where we were either whole bed. This is sort of triage, you know, it was like a M.A.S.H. episode without the funny, and I had, like a hat on

Ellen :

and a battleground hospital to your zucchini bed. Exactly correct.

Trevor:

Yes, I am. I continue what to say about that, because it's 100% exactly the same.

Ellen :

Okay, that's the modern reference.

Paula:

We can sympathize because at Wakeman town farm, we show up one day to do our little gardening and picking beans and maybe tying up tomato vines. And Ryan, the the head gardener at the time, said, Does today we're gonna dig out the squash vine borers from the zucchini vines. And we're like, what we're gonna do?

Trevor:

What the What now?

Paula:

So for two and a half hours, we just slid open the vines. Well, you know, I'm not gonna get into Trevor. No, it's pretty gory. I don't want to know. Well, by the end of the morning, I felt like I had given birth, like it was that kind of heroic.

Ellen :

It's a thing. It's a thing. It is a very I have watched. I was proud.

Trevor:

I think we all can agree that when you put so much time and effort and energy into something that you're growing, you feel very precious about it. You feel very precious about the things that you put your love into. And it is a little funny because it's a zucchini, but at the same time, you really feel it

Ellen :

when I'm like I had for that's my point. Exactly. There was some carpacci. There was a soup.

Trevor:

Now I'm getting hungry, and these little, these little determines, they come in and they mess up your plans, and it's very hard.

Paula:

It's very hard. And you watch it grow, and you're like, it's doing great. And yes, leaves are beautiful, and it looks graceful. And then you come back, and the whole thing is limp. What it was, it was five of them are lamp it was like, Are you kidding me?

Ellen :

It was kind of more like, to me, like a crime scene than like a medical scene, where I was like, what has happened?

Trevor:

And then after that, we got zucchini fleas after that, which are little tiny, mighty, Natty situations which just pockmarked all of the skin. It's great all around. And it was a little bit like a plague, but at the same time, they were still fine. They just looked real rough. Yeah?

Paula:

Well, it might not be too late for you to find a Hubbard squash plant.

Trevor:

I'm gonna go tomorrow. Yeah, and look, I'm like, I'm gonna find some

Paula:

At the end of the season, I had a very successful season with squash that year, and I planted a lot of Hubbard squash outside the garden in like, I have a pollinator garden, and we were cleaning out the pollinator garden, and my husband says, What is this? And I ran over, it's outside the gate, around the around the fence, and there was a 30 pound Hubbard squash. Whoa. I was like, what?

Ellen :

So that that worked

Trevor:

the monster. Hubbard said, Nothing shall eat me. I'm way too big for all of you.

Paula:

Exactly. It was like a pumpkin. It was like, that's amazing. It's like a Hubbard pumpkin. Wow, so I'm always doing Hubbard squash now, like, that's just

Trevor:

Its happening. I love this. And from a data and metrics standpoint, has it been successful? Do you find that there's a percent like, I find that 80% less loss, or what'show well does it work?

Paula:

It does work. It works. And that squash, the cogent squash also is like a repellent. It doesn't. I grew this vine without one squash bug, and I did have, finally, yes, so it, evidently, it doesn't like this variety either.

Trevor:

Guess, guess what we're putting in?

Ellen :

I'm taking lots of notes as we're talking. Yeah,

Trevor:

we'll eat this and save the seeds because they're going in the ground. Oh yeah, they are. They're going in the ground.

Ellen :

So we're talking about natural pest repellents, right? We're talking about companion planting now we're talking about trap planting. So what are some other ways that we can control all of those lovely things that want to get in and eat

Trevor:

our business.

Orna:

So we talk about deer. You need a fence around your garden, and the fence has to be also, if you talk about the round hole, has to go under so they won't go into your garden. There's nothing else you can do.

Ellen :

And we do not have a fence.

Trevor:

We don't, we don't have a fence, but we fairly religiously, like tomorrow, I will do it. We spray liquid fence all around, everywhere. So I buy them in essentially 50 gallon drums, which, that's a little excessive, but no, I'll get a big five gallon container, and then of the concentrate and it dilutes down. So we put, we have a couple of handheld sprayers that we mix it in, and it goes. Is everywhere, and we anyway, I'm not gonna say it, because if you talk about LA traffic, then you're gonna end up in LA traffic. So I'm not saying a word about deer.

Ellen :

other thing we put into which we have to hook up, by the way, we put in automatic sprinklers, or, you know, that go, they put in motion sprinkle sprinklers, deer or not. We did last year was the first year was the first year that we did it.

Trevor:

Because if you forget about it, you always forget

Ellen :

Oh no,

Trevor:

which is usually a good, good indication that somebody's about if you go out a little later at night, when it's dusk and it's beautiful outside, you will get up. I'll sometimes hear gotten wet that when my mom forgets, and I'll hear,

Ellen :

well, and there's a sensor that's very there's one sensor that's very sensitive, very sensitive, yes, so overly, oh, it's still light out. It's fine. And then that one gets you every time. We have not learned we ever not like Pavlov's dog with that. But anyway, so that's so because we don't have a fence. So that is a that was

Trevor:

obviously so fences first line of defense against year and other things. What if you don't have or can't have a fence? What are other methods that you guys have found useful for deterring all pests?

Paula:

Well, when you talk about animals, it's very hard. I think what you're doing is superb. You're spraying. You've probably been spraying a lot because you've had a lot of rain, Yep, yeah, that's one of the downfalls of something like that. However, you can have a mesh secured with rocks, just like draped over, but it depends on how hungry that critter is, right? If it's a groundhog, you might as well just, you know, throw in the throw in the

Trevor:

rag, because, yeah,

Paula:

you're in trouble if you have a ground

Trevor:

we've had one last season that somehow got in, and I'm not exactly sure how, because we do have some stone walls around the garden, yeah, here at Stone Brook. But the he got in and he made it home, and oh, he was happy. He just would just sit and eat the tomatoes and look at me. I then just in spite. And it was awful.

Ellen :

Most insulting part of that was that he was just tasting tomatoes and throwing them aside. Yeah, so sort of like the disdain taking, like, big chunks out, like the and then we've come in the morning and IV. But what I did say to Trevor was, we have a lot of tomatoes. He's not eating the entire bed of tomatoes. So we can sacrifice a couple tomatoes a day to our little friend,

Trevor:

but I moved him far away. Yes, from this place. We'll see if he comes back.

Orna:

I know. Yeah, the same problem. Last year. He had a family, yeah, not all family, because in my niece from Israel was there. Look, this is cute, mommy and babies walking around in the garden. I said, No, no, Leo, we don't want them.

Ellen :

They're not cute. It's how I feel about checkbox. Now, I used to think they're adorable. Now I'm like, get away. But we're talking about bugs other things. What else? What else do we do to manage

Paula:

what we really were taught as Connecticut Master Gardeners when it comes to pests, the number one thing that you want to do first is find out what it is that you're trying to combat, because you can't just inadvertently spray or you shouldn't. One shouldn't, even if it's insecticidal soap or neem oil or diatomaceous earth, you don't know what you're dealing with. The first thing is to identify what is the problem. What's the vegetable? Most vegetables have pests that like that. That's their host plant, right? So, like the tomato horn worm, I've take the I've taken them off, and I've, like, gently put them elsewhere, because I want the the Wasp to to find the worm and eat it, right? So removing the pest is always an option. With the soapy water. You can take a jar and flick Japanese beetles into a jar of soapy water. When it comes to like slugs, you can put a lid from a jar, you know, with the lip up, and fill it with beer, and it'll attract slugs. I've heard about this, but the slugs with the beer, it does work. It does work. Neem oil. I saw on my asparagus, some asparagus beetles, and I sprayed neem oil, and they were they were gone. They were eggs all up and down some of the stalks. I brushed the eggs off with my fingers, sprayed the neem oil, and they were gone.

Trevor:

Yeah, see now this is something that just I'm now terrified my there was an asparagus beetle for everything. I gotta worry about that. That's another thing I gotta worry about

Ellen :

The important part about this is, again, I love what you're saying about knowing what it is that is so you treat everything has a plant that is a host, and we're talking about ensuring that we have the right cycles for pollinators and everything like that. So you want to, you want to ensure that it's a good bug. Is it a good bug? Is it a is it a bad bug? Is it a non native bug? What's going on, right? And that's, that's part of the process,

Paula:

exactly. And also, along those lines, you don't want to spray anything when the pollinators are out, right? Yeah, because they'll affect the good bugs, right as well. So you have to be very judicious about when, how, where. I. Grow dahlias and the earwigs. Yes, I've had problem with earwigs. So diatomaceous earth, which is shell crushed up, and it's a soft bodied insect, so it kills them, so that you can sprinkle that around the base of the plant. But again, you have to know what what you're what you're fighting against.

Trevor:

Easy to go to Home Depot and just get insecticide and spray everything. But that's really not going to get you the solution that you really need.

Orna:

Not only that, you're going to mess up your soil, you're going to mess up exactly the plants. Yeah, like we were saying, send it to plant clinic. They will tell you what it is. They will tell you how to solve your problem as well.

Ellen :

Tell people how do they access I love this plant clinic. Because I always I talk about, we've talked about this before, but you know, when you follow like Connecticut gardeners on Facebook, everybody posts pictures of their plant and says, What's wrong with it? What is this? What is it, or what's wrong with it? But there's an actual number you can call or website. I'll send it, yes, we'll put it in the show notes, and it's part of University of Connecticut, or part of the program of master gardeners. Amazing. And is it like a call? I need help my roses have black spots?

Orna:

Yes, exactly, exactly what it is amazing. You can call on the phone and yeah, but every there was somebody there every day, actually, from nine to three,

Ellen :

oh my gosh, I don't I have this number saved in my

Orna:

Call or send by email. It's nice to send by email call. because then you can add photos into the end of the question, and it's much easier for the person behind that listens. And, you know, you can also get an answer. You can also walk in, but then you have to drive to Stanford.

Paula:

people branches, you know, like, what's wrong with this limb, what's wrong with these leaves, what's this bug? That's great, and you were all just sitting there waiting for people to come in with their problems, they can be solved.

Trevor:

So this is also part of the program where you have to volunteer as as part of the clinic as well.

Orna:

Yes, to stay current, and we still continue to volunteer, getting their certificate. You mean, I think we have one next week. So

Ellen :

how fun now? Well, now look how much more you know, too. That's so cool.

Paula:

That's the great thing about it is we're always learning new things. They put a advanced Master Gardener with interns together, so we're teaching each other and learning alongside each other. So it's great.

Ellen :

But what an incredible way to get trends also in what's happening in our gardens across the state, right? So if somebody's seeing something, I'm thinking of like the first lanternfly things, and does this information gets out, and then it can be disseminated to everybody. If there's a problem people are seeing that's regional or statewide. Is that how it works?

Paula:

Well, that's a very good point, because we have to participate in continuing. What are they? What they call topics. Hot Topics. Could be the jumping, gardening, Goss, love it. I want it. The Spotted lantern fly, yep, different topic.

Orna:

The Jumping Worm two years ago. Yeah, the spotted lanternfly. That's a real problem. Yeah,

Trevor:

we just saw the first. I got four of them off of our off of our roses. Yeah, just that's the first time we've seen them here. A couple of the nymphs that I got off only saw four, killed four. But we'll, I'm sure there's more.

Ellen :

We're on a daily vigilant.

Trevor:

That's so great, I mean, because obviously your clients too, and we really haven't talked about the beginning of the business, and how right after you guys did the program, then all of a sudden you have this huge wealth of knowledge. You have all this continuing knowledge, and now you get to pass that on to people that need help doing exactly what you did in growing gardens and building gardens. So tell us a little bit about that.

Ellen :

How about that? You start? Were you like? We're done now. We're going to do a business

Orna:

not exactly me.

Ellen :

Didn't work that way or not.

Paula:

Orna Had to talk me into it.

Ellen :

I'm sensing a trend. Paula

Paula:

like a puppy dog.

Orna:

We really work very well together. We see sometimes we we don't, we don't plan on something, and we end up coming in the same clothes.

Ellen :

That is a true sign I love that. Yes,

Orna:

we talked about it and said, I need to do something. So I said, Let's start a business, and we start talking to people, and it's really word of mouth. And I think we gave our first talk at outer place in a Fairfield, and people came and like were amazing, and we gave another talk at Richfield, and last shot that you heard, and Wakeman, but people just heard and say, Oh, we want the new garden. And

Paula:

our goal, we felt, was to bring gardening to anybody and everybody, anybody who wanted to grow in a raised planter, in a raised bed in the in the earth, whatever it is, whatever space you have, you can grow, as long as you have enough sunlight and you have the right conditions, you have the right soil and you have water source. So that was our mission to just bring it to anybody and everybody. And wouldn't it be great if every backyard had a little garden where. Children. Could your child or your grandmother, or you could go and pick some lettuce or herbs and put it in your in your dinner, or, you know, use it for your recipe

Trevor:

as if it were yard to table exactly. I mean, that would be, what an idea, what a concept could be, yard one yard at a time. I love that. It's so fantastic.

Orna:

We start with small, because it's better to start small. We don't want to start big, overwhelming.

Ellen :

Yeah, and then that's how we felt.

Trevor:

It's a little different for Ellen and I tend to start enormous and Ellen says Im crazy.

Ellen :

We didn't have a choice. It was already sitting here as a footprint. There was something here, there was something here. And I was like, Oh my gosh, I'm in over my head. But keep going. Yes, beautiful. Oh, thank you.

Orna:

Then we had a client who is a building, build a garden already, and she was just moved from the city. Says, What am I going to do? And it was about 10 by 12, and and we plant. We made the planting plan for her, and we planted everything, and we gave us some lessons how to take care of it, and we we also did some maintenance. It was great. Is that she was so excited, and she bought it was she had little kids. She bought the kid they wanted to pick up the cherry tomatoes. Was fun, and but it's really, it's every this year we are so busy, and we just got a new client with, like, seven beds, three by three and a half by three and a half. So it's like a huge space. And then he wanted the 14 beds and two beds only for herbs, because he's he has a chef, and he likes to cook, and he wants the most herbs that he can get. Yeah, so it's crazy, really challenge. It's a challenge. And every everyone, it's a new story. It's a new something to plant. Think about how it will work.

Trevor:

Are most of your clients experienced? Inexperienced? Is it people that are mostly from the city? Do you have a wide range?

Paula:

We have clients who one had a planter. She said, I've only done herbs, but I'd like to do lettuce this year, and I have a trellis, and maybe I'll do, you know, Can I do a cherry tomato on my trellis? So we planted a little garden. First. She needed a new a new trough, for instance, that's like the smallest thing that we've done. Although we did have a client who had 20 pots on her patio, we helped her kind of reconfigure. We said, you know, these vegetables would do better in a planter, other than these pots, that's why you're maybe not having success. Then a client would come to us and say, you know, these planters were not successful. And I had somebody who's really a flower person come and help me, but nothing really worked. And we looked at it and raised planters were 12 inches deep, and we said, well, your tomatoes aren't going to work here. You need more soil. We ended up just building a structure for her, which she loves and her husband loves. Who was like, this is her thing. I don't want to have anything to do with it. But now he comes out. He's like, we love this garden. It's like, look at this lettuce, look at this piece. Look at so changes here. So great to see our clients, like, fall in love with vegetables the way we have, yeah, we have clients who have existing vegetable gardens, whom, which they've inherited young families coming from Manhattan, yeah, so we help them with their vegetable garden.

Ellen :

Do I do?

Trevor:

What is dirt? Yeah, they start early. What?

Orna:

Just to add to what Paula was saying, we also have repeat clients. Like, people are like, Okay, this is amazing. Come back and do it again, of course, and we maintain there. And this is, like, a great reward for us, because we only want this is, like, only our second year, and it's so nice to know that we can help people.

Trevor:

Yeah, I love that. Yeah. I love awesome.

Paula:

I feel like we're growing with our clients, because they're giving us different challenges. Each one of them, each case, is a different set of circumstances that we have to meet.

Trevor:

And let me ask you, how many people have heard about the Paula's tomatoes situation? And say, I want a lot of that, because that's what Liz was right at the beginning.

Ellen :

Was talking about Paula, there's some you have some special tricks with growing tomatoes.

Trevor:

And we would be remiss if we didn't

Ellen :

there are some very special places that get your tomatoes, if you want to tell everybody a little bit about that.

Paula:

So I guess before I was wild about veggies, I was wild about tomatoes.

Ellen :

Which I get it? There's nothing better. Think I'm on my 10th version of a tomato candle, trying to find the right scent. Perfect One. I will share with you the ones I don't like. I won't say them out loud, because I'm sure some people like them.

Trevor:

You'll do a post about it later.

Ellen :

Maybe I'll do one

Paula:

I have one I want to talk to you about later. All right, good. Yeah, I want to know. So the tomatoes kind of happened organically. I guess the garlic came and then I did broccoli and carrots and radishes, and then my sister came to visit, and she has a farm in Maryland, and she came to visit me with 180 Solo cups with tomato seedlings.

Ellen :

Wow, that's family. That's a good yeah, that's a nice present.

Paula:

Yeah, we were gonna swap. We were gonna swap. I had about 10. She had 180 she left me with a lot. Yeah, and that kind of got me into this crazy tomato world. I had so many tomatoes, and they were all heirlooms tomatoes. Your varieties are crazy. I love just going through tomato catalogs. It's like seed catalogs. It's like an obsession.

Ellen :

Just at your house the other day, there were things I never heard of before. I just, I love that so much. Trevor's looking at a picture, I'm gonna name a couple. Okay, go ahead.

Trevor:

Chocolate pear, Dad's sunset. Evil olive.

Ellen :

Okay, that's amazing.

Trevor:

Mushroom basket, black strawberry. Now, these are, these are, these are names of tomatoes, and I'm looking, and they are, what you can't see, listeners, is, there's this amazing photo.

Ellen :

Paula takes beautiful photos all of the general but these tomatoes, these tomatoes are beyond

Trevor:

they're phenomenal in there, and it's just awesome. I Why don't we have evil olive tomatoes? That's my question, Paula. I'm gonna hook us up with it.

Ellen :

That's for sure, for sure. So, so you start, so you start 118 seedlings. And,

Paula:

well, I planted as much as I had space for. And I already told you about the the garden that my husband built, and he actually, couple years later, he expanded it. Now it's like 50 by 50. I have beautiful, yeah, I just planted as much as I had space for, and had a lot of produce, and I started giving away the tomatoes to my friends, as you do, but it became a lot of work for me, because I'd have to schlep the tomatoes to my friends and, oh, you're not home. I'm sorry. I'll leave it by the door. It just became a lot of work friends come and, yeah, it was like, now, I grew them, I know, I sewed them, I coddled them, I transplanted them, I planted them up, I hardened them off. Now I have to distribute them really. So I ended up going to Barcelona, to the restaurant, not the city. And I said, Hey, would you like to buy these tomatoes? I have extra. And the chef tasted them. He said, I'll take whatever you have, amazing. So that first summer, I said, great, because you're doing me a real favor. I'll pay you.

Trevor:

I'll tell you, any chef, this is a restaurant business that you want people pay you to take their delicious this is a business that can work. So

Paula:

the next summer, I ended up selling to two chefs, and that became a little bit unwieldy too, because Tuesday was this chef, and then there was Norwalk, and there were Stanford, and it was a lot of was also a lot of time I found one chef. The way I found the chefs was I just brought my tomatoes around, and I looked for chefs who are focused on yard to table, farm to table produce. And I said, Hey,

Ellen :

that's really the only chef you want, super local. Can

Paula:

I come by? I have some tomatoes for you to taste? And they all said, yes, please bring them on. So I do sell last, last summer, we were so busy with our clients that I didn't sell any tomatoes. We had to eat them all and freeze some of them. But this summer, I hope to sell again. Yeah.

Ellen :

And can we mention the restaurants that you sold to? So, tavern, a Grey Barns, yes, which is a fabulous restaurant. You said Barcelona. Any other

Paula:

I sold tomatoes to the Whelk and kawani and Don Memo, the chef. He's lovely cafe, the Art Cafe as well. Yeah, so, but I just decided to do one, one chef, and that's the chef at tavern at gray Barnes, Barcelona, had put my name on the menu, and that really gave me, like, such a threat. It's like a chalkboard. Is it? Paula's tomatoes, heirloom tomatoes,

Trevor:

pretty much able to stop. Listen, that's it. I'm retiring.

Ellen :

Listen at the dinner that you came to. You know, when we had the butternut squash, feta whipped dip, had our stone Brook squash, and we were so excited that it said that it said that on the menu, and that was just for people we knew in our backyard. So

Paula:

well, they call me the tomato lady when I go to the tavern at gray barns, because I bring it to the kitchen the back door, of course. And they're like, tomato ladies here, and I put tomatoes in, like trays, like my trays, and then they they take my trays and bring my trays back, my baskets and trays. I love it.

Ellen :

Well, are you going to share the secret? Because when we went to your informational session, you both did at our Le chat town farm, you talked about a little trick you have in planting tomatoes, what you put in the soil.

Orna:

So one of the tricks is to use banana when you plant first of all, you have to dig a big hole, because you want to plant the tomato that the stem still in the ground, because there are hair that goes on the side of the stem. And you plant the tomato horizontal, on top the banana the bottom, and then the planter is horizontal.

Ellen :

This is like a whole peel of a whole banana. Or do you one peel? Okay,

Orna:

one side of the banana. Actually, I have bananas in the we have bananas in your freezer. We go to plant. Clients, we bring out bananas. Oh, amazing. And then what happens is it leans a little bit, and then when the sun comes out, it stands up.

Paula:

So the banana is a preventative for autumn blossom end rot. So the potassium in the banana peel, you can use about a third of a peel for each tomato vine. What Orna is describing is the fact that the tomato, the stem of the tomato, is able to grow roots out from the stem, not just from the bottom of the plant.

Trevor:

So the way that you plant, you dig a not a deep hole, but a long hole, like a trench, like a trench. So you're essentially planting the tomato plant horizontally in the soil.

Paula:

Yes, you can. You don't have to, but you can. And then

Trevor:

if you want to be a tomato lady, yeah, otherwise,

Ellen :

you want to be wild about veggies, you should do it that way, exactly,

Paula:

if you think about it, bringing more nutrients to more roots,

Trevor:

as if you've ever grown a tomato plant before, it is going to go north. It is going to grow big and fill out. But a lot of times that root structure isn't always there, and this is such an interesting way to make sure that you're adding so much more to the structure.

Ellen :

So are you completely covering the seedling? When you're planting horizontal, you leave a little bit up to the top.

Orna:

Okay? You leave, like, what you kind of bend it a little? No, when you're planting it, okay? It's like you, like you lay down on its own, and then you does it that by exactly by itself, put like a cardboard between the soil, and because you don't want the leaves to touch the soil. And then the minute the sun is coming to go up,

Paula:

we also plant. We use microseal fungi when we plant, so that just supports the roots. It gives the roots a way to absorb the nutrients, boost to absorb the nutrients from the soil. And we also sometimes will supplement with Azomite, which is natural substance from the Midwest. I think it's from Idaho. It's naturally found in the soil. In the Midwest, we don't have that. They're the trace minerals, so manganese and modibium, we work with the soil. The soil, that was one of the topics as a master gardener, was soil. And we so health is so important, soil health, and what does good soil feel like? And we had to like, there were tubs of soil. We had to like, mash the soil and feel it.

Ellen :

And Paula, there's something you said when we came to do a tour of your beautiful garden that I loved, and obviously it stuck with me, and I wanted to kind of talk about that. Have you expand on it today, but you said a good gardener is a good observer. Tell us what you meant by that.

Paula:

The garden is different. Every day. I love to go out. My husband and I actually have coffee in the garden as often as we can bring our morning coffee out and just kind of hunt around. We never really even sit. We're just like, hunting around. Or he'll sit. I'm always looking because I want to see what's different, what's happened overnight. If you see something different and you're wondering, why is that leaf curly? It's a matter of observing the changes in your garden. A lot of times it's it's good changes. They're good changes. However, if you see something that doesn't look right, you have to ask questions like, What could have done this? What did I do differently? Or is this leaf scorched? Is it dry? Is the soil heaving? When you make these observations, it forces you to think, What am I seeing, as opposed to just not really looking closely. I just think that it's a great way to observe the changes in your garden is to look closely. It makes you look closely.

Ellen :

All of us have talked about journaling, sort of how you also track that, not just with your eyes, but some people keep actual journals of obviously, when they plant seeds. But you you have a method too that you all do, which is, with photography,

Paula:

I don't love to write, just the act of writing true confession. I love it, but I'm a very visual person, so for me, so rather than keeping a written journal, I take photos of my vegetables, and it's a visual reminder of what was successful, what I loved, what worked. And I have like a time frame. It's like a time capsule. And one of these photos that I brought is the first harvest that I took, not of garlic, but when I did a broccoli and carrots and radishes, peas and beans. And I'll always remember when I see that photo that I pulled the entire head of broccoli out. I didn't know, right? And I remember pulling it out, and it was there was more underground than there was above ground, and it's a beautiful head of broccoli meanwhile, and I thought, Wow, what a waste of all this material to just grow one, one cluster of broccoli flower. It's and I always laugh when I see that, because it reminds me of how much I've learned from that time, from that first harvest. So fun.

Ellen :

That's such an important thing you're saying, though, because we're talking about the growing part, but harvesting is a whole different educational experience. You know, I remember the first time it was, how much lettuce do I cut off of a head of lettuce? Where do I cut it? What is the right way do I stop? Yeah, the fact that you should be changing tools between plants so that you're not contaminating. I mean, there. It's there is so much that we have totally screwed up and learned, right?

Paula:

Because that's what's part of the process, yeah, exactly how you learn. I will never pull out a whole cut and come again. Now, I know.

Trevor:

Are you growing broccoli now?

Ellen :

Are you asking the question, what's going on in your yard?

Trevor:

I am.

Ellen :

So that's our question always on our podcast, is, What? What? What are on your yard? What's going on in your yard? Paula, we'll start with you.

Paula:

Some of the exciting things that I'm growing are the broccoli, cabbage, of two types of cabbage, cauliflower, artichoke, which also flowers for the bees, for the pollinators, for the cover flies. That's so exciting when that flower opens up, because that's after what you would have picked

Trevor:

right?

Paula:

The flower bud is what you eat

Trevor:

the part you don't usually see correct, because we've already eaten it exactly, delicious,

Paula:

exactly. The color is so luscious. It's a lavender. It's so beautiful. I'm also growing some things that I overwintered. They're not for eating, but they're for flowers. Yeah, when you talk about a vegetable that's a biennial, that means, and I didn't realize what that meant. I thought, okay, every two years, but what does that mean? Well, the second year it sends up a seed, it sends up a flower. So I have onions that I've overwintered because that Allium, that flower, is such a beautiful, gorgeous, yeah, pollinator. And I'm doing the same thing with carrots. Love that with carrots. So I have carrots that are overwintering, but then I have like, about 30 different vegetables

Trevor:

Other than that, not a lot. Orna?. What about you?

Orna:

So I have some celery fennel. You have cohort too, beets, which is growing leeks and shallots, which I planted earlier on, and of course, I just put all the tomatoes and cucumber Well,

Trevor:

you have someone that that can give you good tips too on the tomatoes. That's somebody.

Paula:

She's in her own right. She's a good tomato person.

Ellen :

You're both pretty amazing. I think, yes, there's so many questions and there's so many things that we could continue talking about, but we're just so grateful that you both came and talked with us today, and thank you for joining us the table. I know I learned more

Trevor:

Tons and tons and tons. I am also wild about veggies, so this was a good connection that we were able to share the time we've taken up so much of your time, but we really appreciate you both coming on Yeah.

Ellen :

And for our listeners, we'll put all the information about wild about veggies in our show notes, so that you can follow them on Instagram and look them up on their website and all that other good stuff. So congratulations, and for the beautiful things that you're growing.

Paula:

Oh, this was so much fun. Thank you for inviting us. Thank you for coming.

Orna:

Thank you. It's great.

Paula:

It's really fun.

Ellen :

We love a pivot.

Trevor:

Oh, it's great. And they're just so lovely. They're both Paul and Orna. Are just wonderful.

Ellen :

The pivot of it all. And we have lots of guests that are theme in our show.

Trevor:

Yeah, it's like a sub theme. It is.

Ellen :

We knew yard to table and pivots, yeah, but going after the thing that you are inspired by and turning that thing you love your passion into a business. I'm so excited for them and what they're doing and the beautiful gardens they're creating. No that's awesome in our town and in our neighboring towns, because that just supports all of us with that beautiful, organic material they're putting out there and the things that people are growing. And it was just wonderful to hear from them and to hear their vision and how things are going,

Trevor:

And you feel their hospitality and their love of it when you're with them. We were at Paul's garden. Got to see her amazing space, but then also just having them here, it just makes you feel warm and cozy. It's nice

Ellen :

gardening people, they're good people,

Trevor:

They're the best.

Ellen :

Thanks for being with us and having a seat at our table.

Trevor:

Yard to Table is a production of Macrocosm Entertainment. Don't forget to rate us and subscribe anywhere you listen to podcasts and for tips and more information, follow us on Instagram @Stonebrookhouse.

People on this episode

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Ellen Scherer Crafts

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Paula Koffsky

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Trevor Crafts

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