Yard To Table

The Friend We Met in A Yard - Welcome Liz Rueven!

• Trevor Crafts and Ellen Scherer Crafts • Season 1 • Episode 2

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Trevor and Ellen host their first guest on Yard to Table Liz Rueven, a writer, cook, educator, and founder of Kosher Like Me…and yes, they met in a yard!  They discuss their shared passion for local, sustainably grown food and their experiences with the local farming community in Connecticut. Liz talks about the intersection of kosher eating and vegetable forward eating, emphasizing the importance of seasonal ingredients and ethical sourcing. Listen for some good chats on the many deep traditions that connect us and making delicious food. follow her on Instagram @kosherlikeme.

Places we talk about:

 Books we talk about:

  • The Flavor Bible – The Essential Guide to Culinary Creativity, Base on the Wisdom of America’s Most Imaginative Chefs, by Andrew Dorenburg and Karen Page
  • Encyclopedia of Jewish Food by Gil Marks

And to see what's happening with Ellen and Trevor at Stonebrook House follow @stonebrookhouse on Instagram today!

Questions? Ideas? Things you need to say? Message us!

Trevor:

Well, hello Ellen.

Ellen :

Well, hello, Trevor.

Trevor:

Here we are again, back at the table for yard to table. It's another episode of yard to table.

Ellen :

I know. How are you feeling about this journey that

Trevor:

I'm loving it. I think this is exactly what we needed. we're on? I think that this is a great way to share with everybody how much we are renewed by our yard and the things that are going on in our yard and our neighbors yards. It's yard central over here.

Ellen :

Totally. And I think, you know, as we were walking down to the office, and I was walking through the garden, yes, and it's an absolutely fabulous, gorgeous New England day, it is amazing Connecticut. I deep breath and it's just full. It is your happiness.

Trevor:

Is another place of Zen. It is.

Ellen :

And I'm also excited because we have our first guest.

Trevor:

Oh, first guest. Very nice. This is the inaugural first guest. I know who the guest is, and you know who the guest is. I do listeners, you don't know who the guest is, but we'll tell you in a second. But this is very appropriate to have this person be our first guest,

Ellen :

absolutely. And as we continue on at the table here on the podcast, you're going to meet lots of people that have made such a significant impact on us personally in this journey here in Connecticut. And I couldn't be more excited to introduce our first guest today. She's a cook, an educator, a writer, a researcher, who's passionate about promoting and honoring kosher eating. She's an avid supporter of local farms, and provides her readers with information on where to find seasonally grown, organic food and more. She is a force in our community that unites like minded eaters, not all kosher, not all vegetarian, who, in her words, want to eat thoughtfully prepared, properly grown and ethically sourced, delicious food. I mean, who's not on board for that? We all are. We all are so welcome to the table. Our dear friend, fellow yard enthusiast and founder of Kosher like me. Liz Rueven,

Liz :

Thank you so much.

Trevor:

Liz Rueven is here with us

Ellen :

We could not be more excited because, you know, we met in a yard.

Trevor:

You were like our first real friend in Weston. We were cocktail party friends. We were Yes, and it was so Ellen and I had recently moved to this wonderful place that we are in in Western Connecticut, and we were looking around trying to get more information about our local food scene and our local farmers, and found this very lovely little farm called Dirt Road Farm. Dirt Road Farm right down the road from us, literally walking distance from us, which on a dirt road. We had no idea it was there. And we got tickets to this amazing event. And met two of the most loveliest people ever, Liz Rueven, her husband, Moni, and we started talking.

Ellen :

I think it was really very immediate for us. You know when we when we were well, we'll let you tell it. Liz, but I know what my thoughts are.

Liz :

I know we I know we couldn't stop talking. Yes, that's true. And not only were we talking, but we were wandering through Phoebe Cole Smith's garden. We were nibbling on the most incredible food, all of which she had grown in her garden, and it was her grand finale at Dirt Road Farm, before she moved on to Chappaquiddick, where she's now doing amazing things, as she always does, dirt road cottage now, yeah, dirt road cottage, great name. Yeah. Way to brand. Keep the branding, that's right. But yeah, we immediately were in sync. You know, we were walking and talking and nibbling, and where were you from and what do you do? And we just had lots in common. Immediately, was beautiful.

Ellen :

Yeah it really was. And we're like, when are we doing this again?

Trevor:

And that's the fun part, because exactly, it all happened in a yard. It did. It all happened around somebody that was growing something, and it was for us, really the first experience of seeing here all of these people, because it wasn't just the four of us that were at this party. It was full of people that all were connecting over this amazing place.

Ellen :

And we were really fortunate because we met Liz and Moni, and we also got to see because it was sort of the finale, The swan song to dirt road farm for Phoebe, and so she had built an incredible community of people that shared those same values around sustainability, locally sourced food, making delicious food, growing delicious. Just food. So I feel like we kind of walked into, like, I don't know, it was like a master class of it was, it was 100% of incredible humans,

Trevor:

a master class. And we met so many amazing people there. It was essentially, like kind of

Ellen :

sadness that it was ending a bit, yeah, but it really was a celebration of everything that she had put in there.

Liz :

It was really a gathering of like minded people. So whether some of them were just simply enthusiastic locavores, and they were great at eating, which most of us are, or there were some growers, there were some chefs, there were some cooks, there were some writers, there were people in the news world, but everyone was local, yes, and that's the thing about this community. You know, if you dig deeply, and I know that you have, and I hope that you'll be covering that in subsequent podcasts, but definitely, when you dig deeply into this community, and I would call this community The Westin and Westport Connecticut communities, you know, there's a huge amount of farming history. It's burgeoning. Now it's developing. We have an amazing farmers market. We have town farms that are community hubs in both of these communities. And so I think what you saw at that beautiful farm dinner that night was lots of people connected in those worlds,

Ellen :

yes. And I think you just hit on everything that excites us about this local scene. And I know what excites you. You know, we have a question that we thought we'd start to with our with our guests, that you know, I know that you'll appreciate, you know, before we get into anything else, what's going on in your yard right now?

Liz :

Well, it is a jungle. It is a jungle, and we are trying to tame her, but she does not want to be tamed. And that's part of the story is, you know, it's been a very hot summer here in Connecticut, we we have had huge rainstorms. Yes, we're frightened about the heat and the the intensity of the storms separate subject, of course, but we're all thinking about it. But we're growing cucumbers for the first time, and the cucumbers are out of control. I mean, we are laughing because we're finding cucumbers growing on vines that are trailing on the pavement. Well, that's not pavement. It's blue stone.

Trevor:

Let's set the asphalt surrounding your property

Liz :

Yeah. No, no, it's blue stone, as it should be. But things are growing like crazy. We have cucumbers. I only bought the pickling variety, but we have a couple of different pickling varieties, which means that when you when you pick them, they've got these very prickly skins. So yeah, so we're scraping them before we eat them, which was a little surprising to me. I mean, the garden is full of surprises. We're growing nasturtium, which has come in really handy, because now that the greens, we were growing a ton of salad greens, the greens are over. They're like enough with this heat, yeah, yeah. So they end, they peter out as they're meant to, and now we're into eating nasturtium leaves and stems which have strong flavor of arugula.

Trevor:

It was one of the most surprising things, I think, for me in the garden, just the interesting flavors that you get from things that you don't expect. Agree, and nasturtium was one of those lightning bolt flavors for me, that not only are you looking at a beautiful plant, beautiful orange flowers, yellow flowers, red flowers, but you've got this amazing peppery after flavor that just blows you away

Liz :

and fully edible. And every, every part

Ellen :

The flower, the leaves. I mean, it is, it is such a powerhouse vegetable. And last year, for the first time, Trevor made Nassim cookies, which I think we shared with you. Did we share some with you?

Trevor:

They were delicious,

Liz :

I don't think you did. But if you're doing that again, I would love to help you

Trevor:

We need to know if we actually gave her, because now she's sad that you know, so sad,

Liz :

so so sad,

Ellen :

I know, especially because what did you bring us? Talking about your cucumbers, what did you bring us today?

Liz :

So I, my husband really loves pickling he loves pickling everything. So we're pickling our homegrown cucumbers at this time, and that's lacto fermentation. So that's a completely natural process. That's the stuff where it's really helping your gut. So if you drink that juice, which is really stinky, you know, garlicky, salty, cloudy, it's not a sexy juice, I love it, though it's really good. And so we're making our own pickles. We're doing it like crazy on our porch. You know, it's simply very. Very, very clean jars, very clean cucumbers, garlic that we grow and harvest like you do, yes, some fresh dill, which we grow, and water and salt, and we put it in clean jars, and we put it out on the porch, and it gets sun, and within a couple of days, you know, and we're shaking it in between, you know, just inverting the jar gently, not shaking it. And then we look at it and we say, is that cloudy enough? Have they turned sour enough? Because we want it pretty sour. And some people, you know, we've experimented with some jalapeno. I don't love that, because I'm not going for the spice lately, but for a class I just taught, I did pickled red onions, and this area was full of onion farms, by the way,

Ellen :

it was our it is our history here, of course, you know that, yes, and we're going to do a podcast about that, I might have, we might have to have you Back. Amazing.

Liz :

Well, I know, I know people who know a lot about that, so I'd be happy to participate, but I can refer people to you. So I just taught a class, and we can talk about that later, if you want. But in in that class, I taught the, it was adults at Le chat farm here in Weston, and I suggested that they throw in other things into their pickled onions. So if you want to make those pickled onions even more Barbie fuchsia, even brighter pink, I threw in bits of watermelon. I love that combination. Now, pickled watermelon is a revelation, really. I learned about it from my father in law, but you could throw in watermelon blueberries. They could be frozen blueberries too, even raspberries, and you can really up the pink ante, and then you're biting into fruit that's pickled, and your mind is really blown, which is a fun thing to do to your friends and guests.

Trevor:

I love it. Which I love

Ellen :

I've heard about pickling watermelon rinds. I have heard about that in the past, but the fruit itself with the onion, that sounds delicious, that sounds crazy,

Liz :

that's a salad. Yeah, yeah, over your nasturtium greens,

Ellen :

which we are very lucky, by the way, because we also got a jar of Liz's pickled onions and watermelons. So I we have the pickles and the the onions and the watermelon pickling. I'm very happy. I'm already picturing lunch, and I'm hungry now. Liz, you talked a little bit about Le chat farm, and you talked about local farms, I think, tell us a little bit more about your relationship with the local, foreign farms. And I know, you know, seasonal and local, those are things that are extremely important to you. They're important to us. But if you tell us a little bit more about your relationship with local farms and the connections with community, sure,

Liz :

well, I think that we come from a farming history here in Connecticut and during the pandemic, people, I think, finally understood the importance of the farms and the accessibility to seasonal ingredients that they could that they could make part of their meals when they went to Whole Foods and the shelves were empty. And why were they empty? Because, you know, trucks were not moving from California or Mexico to Connecticut. But aside from that, I mean, I really receive all of my inspiration from my local farms. So Le chat farm in Weston is a community hub in a very small town where your homestead is, that's right, I think it's 8500 people here.

Ellen :

I've heard 10,000 but I've never seen, still not a lot.

Liz :

I've never seen 10,000 people at the one market in town or at the one little post office. Yes, but Le chat farm, Wakeman town farm in Westport, and Westport farmers market are really hubs for me in my life, and I've gotten to know lots of farmers who work around helping and supporting those farms, each of those places is very focused on not only providing local Connecticut goods, food, harvest crops, but also in educating our residents and every single person that we Touch by educating them through a class or through conversation at a market, means that local farmers will be more able to sustain themselves and survive in this very difficult time economically and climatically, politically. Yeah,

Ellen :

now it's it's so critical, and you know, your participation in not only supporting them, from, you know, from going to the market, spreading the education around, why those markets are important, but you when it comes to the town farms, you know, you're an educator, you're teaching, so you're literally teaching about these resources. And I know you just had a class last night. You were mentioning, right? So you're teaching at Le chat. I did go and you what else did you teach? What else did you What brought people around the table there?

Liz :

So it was so much fun. So I love teaching at both Le chat in Weston and Wakeman in Westport, and sometimes I feel like I just don't need to go beyond these five miles or seven miles, because we have really open audiences. So I did a class called bountiful summer salads, and I used the word Bountiful, you know, because of its double meaning. It's just, it's a very bountiful time of year. In terms of harvest, we have a huge selection of ingredients. It's now mid July, so it's really peak, or almost peak, or peak season really lasts for quite a while. And I want people to know that their salad should be bountiful. There should be lots of ingredients in them. If you're a vegetarian, If you're a kosher keeper, if you're vegan. I started the planning for that class just by researching exactly what would be harvested in mid July, around the date of my class. And I love that, yeah. And when we did the promo for that, I made sure to say, you know, this menu could vary depending on what happens with the heat and the rain. I mean, this is the life of a farmer. I am not a farmer, but farmers just don't know exactly what's going to happen when? So we prepared four salads, hands on. We had a sold out class of 14 adults. Love it, and I made sure that it was vegan and gluten free, because it's very easy, just like when you're kosher. You know, all fruits and vegetables are vegan, they're all gluten free, and they're all kosher. So why not? So it was a sold out class, and last time I did a class called Middle Eastern dips and spreads really rooted in my passion for the flavors from that region. My husband is Israeli, so I've learned a lot about the food ways of that region, which is an enormous region, of course, that was a sold out class. And then I repeat,

Ellen :

Two sold out classes, by the way.

Liz :

So it was super fun, and the participants are just very excited. And you know, I try not to wash the vegetables before the class. I mean, with the herbs and stuff, it's such a lot of work, so I try to get through some of that in advance of the class. But I wanted the carrots to look really, really dirty, you know? I wanted the cabbage for a simple cabbage salad, to have the dirt in the layers, not because people love to have grit in their teeth, but because I want them to know this is not coming from a shelf that has a sprinkler or a mist or above it. This is coming from the earth and it is dirty. And I think that's why those of us who eat this way are probably healthier, because not only has the food not traveled, we're eating a little bit of dirt. It's probably good for us. I don't know. I mean, there's been a lot of research on that studies. Yeah, yeah. So the class had four salads. We covered a lot, and in advance, I did the pickled onions and trying to remember what else there was something else, but they at Le chat, they want me to provide dessert, and I was just too wiped to bake. So I went to needs bakery, which is spelled K, N, E, A, D, S, clever. So clever. And they've opened a an ice cream shop. And I went there and got whatever they had that was made with local fruit. So they had a strawberry ice cream that was made with Connecticut strawberries, and they had a blueberry vegan sorbet. Oh, so sorry that the ice cream was not vegan. It was the only thing in the class that was not vegan, but the sorbet was and that was made with blueberries from the Hudson Valley. So that sort of leads me into that other idea, which is, you know what is? What is local. So we love to eat Connecticut grown, but it's really important also to support other farmers and producers. So if you know, I buy olive oil from a producer in California, it's, yes, she's 3000 miles away. But global Gardens is growing their own olives. They're pressing their own olives into the most beautiful olive oils. So even though they are far away, it's a small business, so it's all sort of part of the whole gestalt of small business, small farms, local, yes, but that spirit can move out, even if it moves across the country.

Trevor:

Yeah. I mean, here in Connecticut, we have about, I think, 200 local farms, and we always try to get as much local here. If it's not coming out of the yard, it's, we're, you know, we're going to all of our very local within 510, mile radius, farms and farmers. Markets. We just recently were up at the Ridgefield farmers market, and yeah, it was lovely and fantastic. And it's great because you also get to meet so many of the different providers, growers and makers and makers, and you get to see them again and again and again at the different markets. They'll go to Westport, then they'll go over to Ridgefield, they'll go to the other ones,

Ellen :

and it also shows you how hard they're working to sustain what they're doing.

Liz :

I always say all you have to do is go strawberry or blueberry picking in order to understand why a pint of blueberries or strawberries costs what it does and it's expensive, and I know that's part of the argument that people often say, you know, to me about buying local and buying at a farmer's market, and it's true, but if one's budget is limited, you might just choose certain things that are very important to buy locally. I mean, there is nothing like the flavor of a locally picked fruit. Maybe that's the most important thing to you if you have limited budget. So you know, that's a whole other topic.

Ellen :

It's a great topic, though, and I think I love what you said about when you're doing your classes and you are preparing your foods and putting it out for your attendees that you are showing the dirt you're showing. Because one of the things that we've talked about, and I think we have so much more a connection to now, we certainly had a connection to it when we lived in California, but I think being here in Connecticut, growing our own, you know, you forget what, or you maybe you never knew what something looked like coming out of the ground. Yeah. Grow.

Trevor:

Visually, things are so homogenized. In a grocery store, every single piece of fruit looks the same with a five degree variance, and you're not really seeing how wide a range of okay fruit and vegetable and and other grown products can be and still taste incredibly delicious and wonderful in the process,

Ellen :

and are really so much better for you. Oh, yeah, in so many ways. You know,

Liz :

I taught a series to a group of four teens at my home in my kitchen over the course of two years, and it was really wonderful, because I love working with teens. You know, they're so open, and if you can just get to them, mostly through their stomachs, you know, I mean, I like to go through the through the research, and help them to understand the bigger issues. But they love to eat. And we did a series of classes of, you know, locally grown ingredients, and one of their favorite parts was going out to pick herbs from my patio. And I thought that that was just so ho hum, you know. I mean, who doesn't know how to, you know, you know what basil leaves look like, right? But, and they were hesitant at first. They were like, Liz, is this correct? And where do I snip and what do you think? Is this enough? And they always came in with not enough, you know, like they didn't come in with enough flavor. We need flavor. You know, we have tomatoes, we have beautiful olive oil. All you need is basil or another herb, and that's it. And that's the other thing. You know, when you're using local ingredients, they're just they shine. And my cooking is really about and my teaching is really about letting those ingredients shine. We don't have to mask them. We just want them to shine.

Trevor:

I mean, what just as staying on with the with the kids for a second? What were their thoughts about? You know, because they're sort of the next generation of of people that are going to be interested, hopefully, in sustainable agriculture and growing ultra, ultra local yard to table. What are their thoughts about this? What was their experience in seeing how close you could get to produce and agriculture?

Liz :

Well, that's a really great question. I taught a series of classes in global Jewish cuisine. This, this over the course of this past year, and the kids really didn't know very much coming in. They really didn't know very much about culinary history, about cultural history, and certainly not a lot about farming, and how close they can really get. And the only way they can do that, in my opinion, is if their parents grow at home, whether it's one pot of tomatoes and a second pot of basil or nasturtiums. I mean, you don't have to grow corn at home to know that the corn is grown locally. You can go and buy it. I'm not going to grow corn. It's too much.

Ellen :

No, I don't know. I say no, and then then I change my mind

Trevor:

and then you're like, hey, what about this special corn that I've never seen before?

Liz :

But I will say no for now. I will say that, you know, one needs to grow something at home, whatever that is. And the other thing is, if their parents can seek out markets that happen over the weekend, they really. Me, I hope will take them to those farmers markets, because until they get out there, until they say things like, I've never seen that fruit or vegetable before, what is that or boy, it sure is hot. That farmer looks so hot. What do you know? How do you think she's doing? And yes, please bring a cold drink to that farmer or that vendor who's helping you know anyone, but until they get to see the directness of Farm to audience, they really can't understand. So, you know, if at all possible, take those kids to a farmer's market or to a farm on a weekend, lots of farms are open for pick your own or just to shop.

Ellen :

I think that is, it's such an incredibly important point, you know, we've seen that with our with our daughter, you know, and I know a lot of parents face challenges around what their kids are eating, what they can get their kids to eat. We are not. We start. We have those struggles as well. But it's interesting, once we get our daughter out to the garden, or we go to a farmer's market, we sometimes can convince her to try things we're not even actually, it's not with much convincing. We'll hold something up and she'll give it a she'll give it a shot, you know? And that is because

Trevor:

I do have a lot of trouble with the chicken finger plants do not produce as much as I thought they would. It's a shame. Or the mac and cheese, the mac and cheese plants also are challenging, but they can't grow. We do definitely have a much wider range of options for her when she's presented with things. We grew ground cherries last year, and I was 100% convinced that she would not be interested in a ground cherry, and she loved it.

Liz :

Well, one of the reasons ground cherries are so exciting is, first of all, they're both crisp and sweet, yes, so that's a perfect combination. But also they have those beautiful little paper coverings, and they have to be, you know, peeled back. And it's a very good present.

Trevor:

It's like a candy. It's like a little candy wrapper. It's a veggie candy.

Liz :

It's so perfect. It's so perfect. And speaking of ground cherries, Ellen, Ellen and I just went to our little adventure. That's right, we went to a little adventure. I mean, I've been, you know, I've known about VIV at viv's Veggie stand up on Lion's plains in Weston for a very long time. But we went up the other day, and it was Ellen's first time. Because you still are, you don't feel like newbies, and you don't look like newbies, but you still are a little bit

Ellen :

I know it is true that every day I'm amazed at what we don't know or haven't been to yet. So and I always appreciate it, because you're all you always take me to the places that I need to see.

Liz :

So great. But we went up to Viv's and we were like, Do you have any ground cherries or ground cherry plants, because we know that they're not ready to be harvested yet. And it was a very busy and very hot day for her. That woman took a spade, left her customers at the stand, and went into the field and dug up a couple of ground cherry plants for us, stuck them in a pot with a little bit of soil and said, try this just see what happens, incredible. And what I took home was, you know, very meager and very weak looking, and I added more soil to the pot. I put it on my porch. I did not let it get the stormy rains. I did not let it get too much sun, because she advised me that way. And those plants are looking fabulous. They are saying they are, yeah, yeah, yeah, and they are ready to go in the ground. So, you know, ground cherries are amazing. Kids love them because it's a little present, but also it's, you know, a little fruit, and it's very other. It's not an apple. It's kind of the opposite of an apple, and which is great. We love apples, but

Trevor:

like nasturtium, for me, it's another one of those sort of mind blowing vegetable flavors where you're thinking it's one thing, and then in your mouth, this sort of produce alchemy occurs, and all of a sudden you have a totally different flavor, and it's sweet and it's tart, but it's both at the same time, and it's crisp, but it's still got that sort of uniqueness to it. And it's tangy sweetness,

Ellen :

it's it's sort of, it's

Trevor:

crazy thing.

Liz :

And the other thing about them, which is super fun for kids, is you don't pick them, you wait for them to hit the ground, that's right, and then you collect them from the ground. So speak about dirt. Hey, you know we'd love that dirt.

Ellen :

The dirt is good. Dirt is good. But my kids love dirt, by the way, so,

Liz :

but pick picking things off the ground is super fun.

Ellen :

Totally, yeah.

Trevor:

As long as you know what it is? Yes, yeah, because you don't want to pick anything up and eat it. That's a that can be a challenge,

Ellen :

something that kids do like to do as they do.

Trevor:

They do what is in your mouth? What is in your mouth? Why

Ellen :

are you eating that? Oh, okay, that's fine. That's okay. That's

Trevor:

okay. No, that's okay, yeah,

Ellen :

that's fine. And Liz has made me a promise that, because we had more ground to plant ground cherries this year, when it's time for them, we're going to work on a tart together, right?

Liz :

I love that idea. What are we putting in that chart? Tart with the ground cherries?

Ellen :

Well, you know, last year I made the tart with cherry with cherry tomatoes and ground cherries. And I think I shared that recipe with you, and you gave me a couple fine tuning points. I don't know. I think should we go sweet? Should we go savory? I think we try both. Well, I'll tell you what I would do, tell me, tell me

Liz :

I would turn to some of my resources, and I think that that's that's a very beautiful thing to have in your library. If there are a couple of books, I use a book called the flavor Bible,

Ellen :

which you highly recommended to me. And it is the flavor Bible, the Essential Guide to culinary creativity. And it is a gem.

Liz :

It is a gem because they list tons and tons of ingredients, vegetables and fruits, mostly, and they help you to understand the flavor profile of it and which flavors can pair with it. And they kind of, you know, use text and print to highlight what's best with it and what might be worth experimenting with. But you know, if you want to make a tart and the season, you know time is running. You can turn to a book like that, and it will help you to know which flavors to pair with it, because I'm dying to know which herbs are going to go with ground cherries, and should we be pickling them? By the way, I don't know.

Ellen :

My head's going in a million directions right now, but that, literally, the ground cherry tart conversation last year was what led you to the recommendation of the flavor Bible and and I think you know, and we do want to be talking about these recommendations on the podcast. And I know you have a very extensive library of of cookbooks and culinary instructions and all of those good things. But you know, besides that, you know, what are your essential books that you would recommend for new or experienced home cooks.

Liz :

There are a lot of great books that came out this year, and I haven't been investing in them at this moment. I've just been very, very busy. I don't know, you know, teaching has been really great this summer. It's been a big year. It's been great. Yeah, it's been really great. But, you know, I love the Encyclopedia of Jewish food by Gil marks. I use this book all the time because, you know, all holidays really should involve seasonal foods. So if let's say for the fall, first of the fall series of holidays, which is Rosh Hashanah, the beginning of the new year, apples and honey are often eaten. But when you do the research in Gil Marx's book, The Encyclopedia of Jewish food, what you find out is that lots of other foods are symbolic. You find out why they're symbolic, and they come from other cultures that are outside of this, what we call Ashkin normative culture, which means the culture that I come from, where everyone was from, Eastern Europe, in my community. And so we call that, you know, those, those of us who come from that region, are called Ashkenazim. And ashkenormative means that's the way we saw the world through that lens. But when you use certain research tools, you find out that there are other symbolic foods beyond, let's say apples and honey. And you know, good researchers and great food encyclopedias help me to understand what they are, and then use them.

Trevor:

I think one of the things that I want to for we know because we know you, and we have a lot of friends that that also keep kosher. But for some of our listeners out there that may not know exactly what it is, they've probably heard the term keeping kosher or something's kosher, but tell us a little bit more about what it actually means, where it comes from, and how it how it impacts your diet and what you bring to the table?

Liz :

Yeah, it's a great question, and it's often very mysterious for people. And the laws come from the Old Testament. The laws are extensive. Most people don't know the laws, even if they grew up like I did in a kosher home. My grandparents were kosher. My home is kosher. My daughter keeps a kosher home. It really, the laws really have to do with foods that are considered. Here are the air quotes Fit to Eat. So certainly,

Trevor:

she did do air quotes. By the way, you can't see it out there, but

Ellen :

I do air quotes all the time, yes, so you know, will this notify the listeners? Right?

Liz :

So the lists of food are extensive, and they are actually listed in the Old Testament, and that's pretty incredible. So these laws of Kosher have lasted and been honored for 1000s of years. There are certain foods that are kosher by nature, so all vegetables and fruit, as we mentioned, all herbs are kosher, and that's incredible, and that's why so many kosher keepers, and that includes me, eat as vegetarians when we're away from our kosher kitchen. So it just means that we're just eating veg. Certain things are kosher by nature. Culture, like certain fish and sometimes that helps us to determine where we vacation, because we want to make sure it's not a place where, let's say the whole celebratory culture is around shellfish, certain things are not kosher by nature, like shellfish and pig and other foods, and some foods are determined to be kosher, depending on how they've been examined and slaughtered and whether they are air quotes Fit to Eat So, and also we separate milk and meat. So in my kitchen, I have service for 12 in both dairy that's pots, silverware, dishes of all sorts, and service for 12 in meat, air quotes dairy and meat. So, you know, if you came to my house, you really wouldn't know that it's a kosher home, unless you wondered if the potatoes had been sauteed in bacon fat. And, you know, no one comes around asking that. So, you know, I'm shopping the farmers market and growing food, just like all of my friends. It's just that in our home, we have a we have an awareness of the potential holiness of food, and it comes from these laws, which have been passed down. And when we eat out, instead of looking at a menu and it being everything is fair game, we look at the menu and we say, is there fish and are there vegetarian dishes on this menu? And if so, we're comfortable eating those. There are different degrees of Kosher. So many people don't eat in restaurants that are not certified kosher. We do. So you know, different degrees, different strokes.

Trevor:

So did do you think that keeping kosher for you helped to foster this interest, this love of ultra local growing? Do you think if you weren't kosher, that you would have those same kinds of connection points. And I'm sure it's different for everybody, but just for you,

Liz :

yeah, it's a great question. I grew up going to a church parking lot with my mother in Westchester in New York State, and that's where we would buy locally grown things. The farmers were Amish. They were coming from a few hours away, and I don't recall my mother being particularly friendly or not friendly with them, so I would say it was kind of imbued in me. But my family didn't grow anything. My grandfather was a baker. There was a lot of baking going on, lots of regular lots of onion rolls. Onion rolls need to be they need to come back in a big way.

Trevor:

I totally agree with that.

Liz :

I mean, I love babka as much as

Trevor:

the everybody likes babka. It's not a thing. I mean, it's almost becoming just Ultra normative. It's a meme. Too much. It's a meme. It's a meme.

Liz :

I'm looking for some onion rolls, soft, doughy, moist poppy seeds. Yes, that's what I'm looking for.

Trevor:

I love that. You Yes, yes, please. Yeah.

Ellen :

You know, it's interesting. You talk about growing up with going to places where farmers or local growers sold very informally. You know, it was formal for them. They had to have a place to go and to sell. But I think about growing up in southern New Jersey, and we were really in the farm part of our state, right? So we had huge the

Trevor:

Garden State. Is the garden, not the oil refinery state? No, some seem to think that's a very small portion of New Jersey. It's hard. I know I agree.

Ellen :

I agree. I grew up by the ocean. I grew up in the the southern part of the state. We had so many local farm stands to pick from. We knew who had the best corn, you know, we knew who had the best tomatoes, a jersey tomato, you know, just I can remember being so excited as a kid to get that tomato, slice it up and put mayonnaise on white bread that was living that is delicious, so good. But, you know, I think that a lot of those farms, and what we've seen and what you spoke to before, you know, it's hard for people, for small farms to keep that sustainability and to keep it profitable, to be able to so, you know, that's where I think the rise in farmers markets really have come to allow to have a more formalized way for these smaller growers to have a place to go. But, and I think it's really, again, to your point, and what we talk about is so important to support them because of that, because we need to sustain that if we're not growing it ourselves, or we need supplements to things we grow. We didn't get any lettuce this year because we had a late a late planting, because we were making the beds higher and we were putting in new soil. So we were really excited to be supporting our local farmers, markets and growers and getting and getting those types of things.

Trevor:

And I think that's the fun part about having a very local community of growers, is that you're not going to. Grow everything. You're not gonna Liz grow corn. You've said it, you've put down the I will not I've drawn the line of corn. That is, it not gonna happen.

Liz :

I drive three miles up the road to Viv, yeah, in Weston, and she does not grow corn either. She gets it from another farmer. So really, what it is, it is, it is a chain, and we are all connected, and until as consumers, people understand the connectedness, they really they can't support their local economies the way they really need to. So you're supporting local economy. You know, someone once said to me, but VIV doesn't grow her corn, and I said, but she supports someone who grows the corn 20 miles from her. So isn't that good enough for you? You You know, no judgment, but you shop at Whole Foods, right? And that's fine. You also shop at Stop and Shop, and that's fine, because sometimes you need to buy, you know, stuff that is in those places. Windex, oh, you but, yeah, she's

Ellen :

got a natural solution for you.

Trevor:

I'm sure she does. But sometimes, yeah, clean a window, yeah,

Liz :

but the more, the more we understand the connectedness Ellen you are. So right then, you know if, if my ground cherries are happier than your ground cherries this year, we'll use mine in that tart. And if you need my books to figure out the flavor profiles that we should be exploring, we'll be sharing that, and we'll be sitting on the floor in my family room. So that's,

Ellen :

which is what we love about this community the end. And you're right. It's so supportive. And you know, it's, it's our it is that idea that you're saying it's very much true. It's like we're sharing what we're growing in our yards, we're supplementing each other, and we're supporting the more you know, the the farms that are growing as well. So I mean, there is, it's such a cycle, and it's and it's one of the many reasons we love this community that we're in.

Trevor:

But I think it's also surprising that you don't realize how much sharing goes on in a local agricultural community like we have,

Ellen :

all you have to do is go on to Mom's in Weston, the Facebook page, and someone is getting wants to give away eggs.

Liz :

Is that right? That's true. I need eggs right now

Ellen :

do, yeah,

Trevor:

how many eggs you want?

Liz :

Well, you don't have chickens. I know that, no, but my neighbor has chickens. Okay,

Trevor:

she brings us a lot of eggs. So love that if you need 18, you can walk out with 18 today, yeah, I could use 18. Done, yeah, sold American, yeah. But I think that, you know, even in our earliest days, we have a lot of maple trees here, and we talked about Phoebe Cole Smith and her husband, Mike, they had an amazing maple sugar bush that was, that was right next to their house. They made amazing maple syrup. And Mike came over. I didn't know him. Did

Ellen :

you mean Sugar Shack? You said sugar bush? It's

Trevor:

a sugar bush. It's a sugar bush. Yeah,

Ellen :

I didn't know that. All right, sorry, it's a sugar bush.

Liz :

What's a bush? Do you mean a bush as we know a bush

Trevor:

you call a bush, you call a group of sugar maple trees a bush? No way. Yes, you do.

Ellen :

We just learned something. I tried to correct him, no, yes,

Liz :

I do. Well, that's, that's how we learn.

Ellen :

It's totally marriage. You

Liz :

were out in the bush, just around the corner.

Trevor:

That's what it's called, Yeah, amazing, good stuff. And Mike came over. I didn't know him, really, from anybody. Well, you met him that night, him that night, when we all met that same that same day, and he said, Yeah, come over and I'll, and I'll, and I'll take a look see what you have. Because we didn't really know all of what we have. We have 400 taps here. We have a lot of sugar maple. And he was so helpful. Showed up just giving Hey, yeah, he just drove up and, Hey, Mike, what's going on now? Just came to look at your stuff. But that's just a little, a little snapshot, a little microcosm of the larger group of all of us.

Liz :

I think that what people because sometimes people ask me, you know, like, how do you know all this? And I say, I speak, I talk, I ask questions. So speaking of one of the classes that I taught, you know, I at the end of this class that I taught over two years to these four teens, we did a class on salad, and I didn't have a recipe, and we went to the farmers market, and I said, you know, let's talk about the elements of a delicious salad. So we started with greens, and we went to one of the farmers, and they kind of whispered to me and said, How do I know what that lettuce tastes like? Because let's say there were five or six greens. And I said, Ask your farmer, ask your farmer, and if you ask,

Ellen :

I just want to pause on that real quick, because that in itself is so critical, not just for kids teens, but for adults, we are so afraid to ask such a simple question. Don't you think, I mean, you know, if and when you're in, like in a farmer's market, you. Yeah, that's, of course, your farmer, your grower, your vendor, wants you to know what that tastes like.

Liz :

I insisted, because they were feeling so shy, and I said, you ask if you may taste a leaf from each of these heads of greens. And they were like, No, we can't. We shouldn't. We can't. And I said, why not? And the farmer was thrilled, yeah, I had given her a heads up that I was bringing a class. But still, you know, when you don't know if the green is going to be peppery or mild or sweet, I mean, there was the bitter side you don't know exactly. So I said, What? What do you like in a salad? And then, you know, we built them out from there without a recipe, which is, I love this, really, the way I think most people cook, and if they can shop for beautiful ingredients, the way we're talking about, or if they can grow them, there's really not that much to think about. Because, you know, the adage, what grows together goes together, is so true. Yes, we have cabbage growing like crazy mad right now, not the sexy vegetable, I know it, but I love it, delicious. So good for your gut. And onions are coming up too, and herbs are coming up too, and red peppers are coming up too. Why not toss them all in a big bowl and then start tasting? And that's what I was talking about in my class the other day when we were tasting olive oils and vinegars that come from my friend Theo at global gardens in California. And she sent me these beautiful flavored, infused olive oils and vinegars, including a hibiscus vinegar that she's calling Barbie Licious, of course, because she's got a great sense of hurry. I love it. And I said to everyone in my class, just take out teaspoons and we're going to start tasting. You know, is this olive oil bitter at the finish? And do you like it? It's not good or bad.

Ellen :

How did that go? What was the experience? Had anyone done anything like that before in the class? I mean, I'm sure you probably had some folks that were a little more experienced with that kind of tasting, but Well, overall, yeah,

Liz :

it went pretty well, you know, until you've done, let's say, a honey tasting, and we've done those with Marina at Red Bee right up the road, who's growing and producing and managing beautiful bees, until you do a Honey tasting or an olive oil tasting. People aren't quite sure about putting, you know, a spoonful of vinegar or olive oil in their mouths, but most people have done wine tasting, that's right. And if you've done wine tasting, you know, it's all the same. You know, you want to look at it. And it's the same with shopping in a market. You know, look at the greens, smell them, taste them, see what, see what it presents to you, and let that inspire you. So, yeah, it went pretty well. You know, some people are hesitant and some people are open. You know,

Ellen :

I love that.

Trevor:

So speaking of people getting a much broader understanding, not just of olive oils, but of a lot of different things, you started kosher like me. So tell us a little bit about how that started and about what you cover. And everybody should 100% immediately after listening to the podcast. Of course, go to kosher like me.com, and see all of Liz's amazing recipes and everything. But tell us.

Ellen :

Follow her on Instagram. Follow everybody. Share all those links in the next 100%

Liz :

Thank you. Well, I've taken a break from blogging, but I have 12 years worth of content on the blog. So you know, whether it should be, it's deep, it's deep, and whether it should be turned into a book or not. I am still deliberating, but right now I'm really posting on Instagram. So you know, short, short blog posts like that, you know, but when our youngest went off to college, we rented an apartment in New York City, and we started spending three or four nights in the city. And unlike many people in Connecticut, we had never lived in the city. We had lived in Boston, and we came here with our oldest child from Boston. So going into the city was pretty exciting, and I started to do research. Because we were there three or four nights, we started to do research about restaurants that had veg friendly vibe, because we were happy, and we are happy to eat veg and fish in a restaurant. And yes, there are a large number of Kosher restaurants in New York City, some of which I like, many of which I'm sorry to say I don't really like, because I'm not a steak and potatoes kind of girl. But so we start, I started doing a lot of research about restaurants, and people would say to me, oh, you know you went. I Where are you eating in the city? And how do you know that it's appropriate for someone who's kosher like you? And so I started writing about restaurants, and I really loved doing that because I would order, like, six dishes, and if I didn't have a friend to come and eat with me, you were doing the tasting and the completion. Yeah. Shout out to my girlfriend, Ilana Lichtenstein, who, God bless her, that woman knew how to eat, and she. She would come with me whenever she could. But, you know, I would go at 1130 in the morning, just, you know, when they would open lunch service. I would get a table by the window, and I would order six dishes. I would lug a camera. You know, it was all like amajor schlep. So then I started shopping the markets in the city, Union Square market and other markets, and was really happy to find product that I loved. I mean, I wasn't so sure about some of the farmers that were selling there. It seemed to me that some of them were not selling directly from their farms, and that's a whole other topic of conversation. But I loved discovering small businesses and products that were being sold at the markets, and so I started writing about restaurants recipes. I really never wanted to be a recipe writer. It's not my most favorite thing to do. My most favorite thing to do is really to find out what the story is. What is the story behind a small business, a small producer, you know, someone who's making tahini, or, as we say, it the proper way, tahina, get it right down there in the throat. Tahina, yeah. So you know who's making? Trevor's better, yeah, give it to me. Trevor. Tahina,

Ellen :

you got it. Yeah, I knew it. Go ahead. Accents,

Liz :

who's making tahini, who's making jams, who's making halva, who's making,

Trevor:

I love Halva pickles.

Liz :

Oh, I have a recipe for you. Oh, Trevor. I love it so much. Oh, we can use that recipe if you want to post something. I love it. Yeah, I love it. I was actually going to talk about that recipe because I just revisited it last night. Tell me, yeah. So let me just finish. I'm gonna give it to you one sec. Hang on. So anyway, so I just started exploring more broadly. And listen, the word kosher is appropriate for some people to see, and it's welcoming, and for some people, it's a little polarizing. What I always wanted, and what Ellen put in her incredibly intuitive intro about me is, you don't have to be kosher and you certainly don't have to be vegetarian. I am not, but I eat a lot of vegetarian. I interested in thoughtful sourcing and in discovering stories and small business stories. So, you know, I kind of cover the gamut, and I have an index on the website that hopefully will help you to sort through categories like salads versus breads and holidays, so that when it's and that includes American holidays like Thanksgiving, because, you know, it's not just Jewish holidays that we celebrate, it's certainly Thanksgiving, like most Americans, and when it's Thanksgiving, you know? I if you're making pumpkin pie cool, if you see that there are brussels sprouts growing on stocks that are two and three feet long in your market, cooler? Yeah, use them. I can help you with that. So, you know, I just started writing more broadly, and I hope that it was an adventure for my readers, and I hope it still is on Instagram at kosher like me that, you know, you never quite know what I'm going to be focusing on, but I try to let people know where my resources are so that they can live a more sustainable life. Also, that's awesome. Well,

Ellen :

I think that, and I think when you follow the journey on kosher like me, I mean, that is such an integral part. I mean, you are so good at putting in what those resources are and really giving a lot of detail around the things that you're putting out there. And that's why I think it's so essential to follow. And what I follow along and use many things. Thank you that you put out there. Thank

Trevor:

you recipe. Let's get to it. Oh, I

Ellen :

knew he was going back to this hit me. I have more questions, but let's get the rest. I want to do

Liz :

it. Okay, so I looked it up. I'm going to reference it here in my notes. Okay, so one of the things that I really love to do is to collaborate with small producers, small businesses. My father was a small business owner, and he taught us the value of supporting small businesses from the time, you know, I could walk and talk so I love it is literally America. It is America. And finding small businesses that produce beautiful foods is easy, and you know, some of them are on the shelves of your whole foods, but I would say, go to your farmers market and you'll really find some small producers that are doing some incredibly fantastic things. And you know, for the holiday of Rosh Hashanah, the head of the new year, usually in September this year, it's in October. We. Say, never on you know, always early, always late, never on time. And that's the joke, because the Jewish holiday dates move around by a different calendar. We're like, oh my god, it's so late. Well, you know, when is it on time? Anyway? So I, one year, I was doing a collaboration with seat and mill, which is a tahini and haliva producer at Chelsea Market, and they sell online. Also, it's female owned. Most of the businesses I really just fall for happen to be female owned, and I love supporting them. And one year, I did a collaboration with them, and I wanted to come up with a dessert that was dairy free so it could follow a meat meal, because we don't eat dairy in the same meal with meat. And I came up, you know, I created a recipe that was an apple compote, because we love apples for that holiday, with honey and Halifa and tahini and dairy free yogurt. And I made a parfait from that. And I have pictures I might have to

Trevor:

literally tearing up right now. Sounds so good, if you love Halifa.

Liz :

And you know, the creaminess of tahini in any kind of baked good is fantastic. And

Ellen :

again, that that surprise, right of something you think of as savory, I love that twist, you know, to put it into something sweet that it just punches it up. It makes it more interesting. And it's, it's such an incredible combo, that's right?

Liz :

And people love layering things, you know, if you have, I mean, I have some old fashioned glasses from my mom, you layer these things in a glass, and you've got, like, a dairy free yogurt, an apple compote, which takes almost no effort to make, you know, a light skim of Tahiti. Maybe you've mixed it well, yes, you have mixed it with some honey you could throw out, throw in some bittersweet chocolate shavings, and you've got a lot, yeah, and you've got a layered dessert that is, it now incorporates some of the elements that we always ate traditionally for that holiday, mostly apples and honey, but in a completely new way, and in a way that is more globally. It speaks more to our global tastes at this time. And I don't dismiss a beautiful apple or honey cake. I serve them and I make them. It's just not my favorite for whatever reason. It just doesn't feel like there's, you know, unless you use really beautiful ground spices, which are easy to find. You know, I like things that just have a more nuanced flavor, more interesting

Ellen :

and beautiful looking as well, in the in that old in that old layers, yeah, of course. I

Trevor:

love about adding the halva in is that also it's and for those listeners that don't know or haven't had it before, it is got a very interesting consistency that's almost like a, like a short, bready kind of

Liz :

I thought you were going to use the word that all halava sellers and producers hate, but it's so accurate. You go ahead and then what? What's the word? Well, the word is chalky.

Trevor:

No, I don't say I never. I've never, I've never read it as a palette, chalky. It's always been more chewy. And it's gotta, it's, it's, it's like ground cherries, like nasturtium. It's very hard to categorize, right? You know, it's sesame based, and it's this wonderful sweet dessert. I think one of the things about parfait so much, unless you need like a granola or something that's really boring, you know, you it is a one noted textural dish, but having that in, you're getting a little bit of more of that chewy sort of structure, and being able to layer it in with some of the other elements that are more traditionally parfait. That sounds fantastic. Trevor, you

Liz :

are a great eater.

Trevor:

I do. I have been known, have been known to put something away every now and again,

Ellen :

and honestly. Liz, it gives us hope, because, evidently, as a young child, not so much Bologna,

Trevor:

hot dogs, cereal, mostly Corn Pops or Apple Jacks, yeah, and mac and cheese, and that was essentially my entire palate.

Liz :

It's hard for parents to have hope when the kids are young. It's really hard

Ellen :

my daily inspiration and again, you know, we joke around our child's eating and how we eat and what we expose her to, and still what she sticks with, right? But we are continue. We know at some point the door will

Trevor:

open. It did for me. Trevor is very hoping it does for her.

Liz :

They all grow up, as they say, That's

Ellen :

right. Well,

Trevor:

Liz, we've had so much fun talking to you. I have one more question. It's a big one, if you were going to cook your favorite meal to bring to the table, what would it be? Go,

Liz :

it's a really big one. Go, hit us. You know, I'm really, I'm really thinking, for some reason, you know about the fall, because although we're in peak season right now. There are certain things you know that happen between summer and fall that are quite magical. And one of the most magical moments for me was when I learned about Brussels sprout leaves. Brussels sprout leaves, yeah, Brussels sprout leaves when you're when you're at a farmer's market, especially in the northeast, but probably in all sorts of places here in this country, you'll see the large, you know, two or three foot long stalks of Brussels sprouts. Attached are the brussels sprouts as we know them, the ones that we love to roast and get crispy, believe it or not, those are called nubs. And then there are leaves at the top. And it kind of looks like hair or a crown. Not that they're hairy, but they look like a crown. And those leaves are easier to manage than cabbage if you want to roll them and stuff them. So Ooh. And they also are not as stinky as the nubs, which is so interesting. This

Ellen :

is a little bit it's a little more mild.

Liz :

They're mild, okay, yeah, and they're pliable. So, you know, they're kind of like people that you love.

Unknown:

I love that analogy, a little bit

Liz :

more mild in spirit, a little bit pliable. And so if you feel

Ellen :

like I want to hug, you know, Russell leaves, yeah, yeah.

Liz :

Some farmers now, package, not package, but, you know, gather them in a, in a, in a pile, so you can buy them like that. And then just, you know, it's so much fun to to walk around the rest of the market and to find out what else is out there. So, you know, chop up some kale, if you find it. Chop up some end of Season tomatoes, you know, boil up some simple brown rice. Make a vegetarian stuffing. I have a recipe for this on kosher like me, roll them, make a sauce. I have that there for you. And I love a slow cooker. What can I say? I think a slow cooker is one of the best things in the world, agreed. So I would say people love that, and they're always surprised by that. So is that my most favorite? You know, my most favorite at the moment, stereotypical, really stereotypical is chicken soup, only because my grandchildren love it more than anything in the world. But

Ellen :

it's a wonderful reason. Yeah.

Liz :

So, you know, I have lots of great food that I love, but that's a fun one, especially for the fall.

Trevor:

I love it because I think one of the things we always find so much fun is the impress your friends and family game, because you've always have these weird, unique foods that you're trying and you're growing and you're trying to figure it out, and you find this really cool dish, and then you put it in front of people, they're like, Oh, you. You made this, you grew this, you this came from it's so much fun to do that.

Liz :

I agree. Yeah.

Ellen :

Well, I think this has just been a delightful time. It could go on forever, and it will, because I will be seeing her after this. That's very true, which I hope to every as much as I possibly can. We've

Trevor:

taken up so much of your time. We so appreciate you coming to our table, hanging out with us, and so excited

Liz :

about your podcast. I have to say, I think that this is a fantastic thing, and you two are the perfect. You're so sweet, perfect. Thank

Trevor:

you so much.

Ellen :

Thank you.

Trevor:

We appreciate it.

Ellen :

We appreciate you, and so much love to you and your family, and we can't wait to be around the table with you again. Love you guys. Love you too,

Trevor:

and that's how we do it. That was it.

Ellen :

Oh my gosh. That was so much fun. That

Trevor:

was so cool.

Ellen :

Oh, I

Trevor:

love Liz is the best. She's so

Ellen :

much some Liz Rubin, that was, that was epic. First guest interview, epic.

Trevor:

Totally, totally epic.

Ellen :

Well, I know there was a lot of information that we talked about. I don't have to

Trevor:

go back and re listen again and again and again and again and again,

Ellen :

but you listeners will get all of the notes in the podcast, notes of what we talked about today, recipes and links to kosher like me, books, all the books we suggested, books, all that other good stuff. So please take take a look and start your journey.

Trevor:

That's right, and we'll see you next time around the table at yard to table. Can't wait. Yard to table is a production of macrocosm entertainment. Don't forget to rate us and subscribe anywhere you listen to podcasts and for tips and more information, follow us on Instagram at Stonebrook house.

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Ellen Scherer Crafts

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Trevor Crafts

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Liz Reuven

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